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Double dip!

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Double dip!

Post by Adele Carlyon on Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:43 am

First topic message reminder :

And it's all Europe's fault! Well I suppose it makes a change from it being labours fault!
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Phil Hornby on Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:54 pm

" we can see what their plans are rather than be held back by the liberals..."

There was absolutely no need whatsoever for the Tories to 'be held back by the Liberals'. They could either have refused to enter a coalition and maybe forced another election, or they could have opted for minority government.

It was only Cameron & Co.'s insatiable lust for power at any price that persuaded them reluctantly to take a ride on LibDems' backs. The fact that they now expect that their co-conspirators will do exactly as they are told,until Cameron feels the time is ripe for spitting in Clegg's face, is symptomatic of just what having a Conservative for a 'partner' really means...

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Mel on Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:03 pm

Yes Adele and Phil, we all know what the barstewards plans are as they are always the same, transfer wealth from bottom middle to the few, the rich. Simple!!!!
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Re: Double dip!

Post by tlttf on Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:43 pm

Is it just me or do most others on here laugh at the champagne socialist that was sacked from the bank?

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Red Cat Woman on Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:06 pm

tlttf wrote:Is it just me or do most others on here laugh at the champagne socialist that was sacked from the bank?

Who was this so called champagne socialist then?
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Ivan on Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:27 pm

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Phil Hornby on Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:31 pm

" Is it just me or do most others on here laugh ..."

Careful, landy - they may not exactly be laughing with you...! Very Happy
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Red Cat Woman on Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:38 pm

Ivan wrote:

Sorry Ivan, you quite right.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Mel on Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:29 pm

Red Cat Woman,

It's me the bum is referring to. He's just another Tory supporter who knows they are losing the fight and can only attempt to fight back with personal insults. Sad that some people are like that. They have been fortunate, live in Chelsea, money is no object and it is their God and sod anyone else attitute. Typical Tory I suppose.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by witchfinder on Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:49 am

Austerity measures are harming job creation around the world says the International Labour Organisation.

Clydesdale and Yorkshire banks to cut 1400 jobs

HSBC confirms 2200 job losses

Three different headlines from the BBC News front page, if Mr Cameron happens to be looking in, do you think there is any connection ?, and remember that HSBC were not amongst the banks who received government / state funding during the financial crisis.

Its a fact that like property, the construction industry and the motor industry, banking activity is a reliable indicator of hew the economy is shaping up; And so after 2 years of a Conservative government, how much better now is the British economy. ?
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:59 am

Announcement from Westminster. Sad

It is with regret we have to announce the imminent demise of the British Economy.

As you will know the economy contracted 'bankers syndrome' some time ago, and this, coupled with 'Euro depression' has brought about a great deal of concern in the country, and in Westminister. The current 'surgical profession' have tried, and are trying, various methods of surgery and placebos, but to no avail so far.

Hopes now depend on a new 'vaccine' called 'growth' hopefully being prepared in time for the next GE. This stimulates, rather than cuts. This will replace the current 'austerity' pill which appears ineffective.

Where the 'surgeons' have failed, may the (prospective) new 'doctors' prevail.

But then, what do I know. Wink
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Red Cat Woman on Tue May 01, 2012 1:15 pm

Mel wrote:Red Cat Woman,

It's me the bum is referring to. He's just another Tory supporter who knows they are losing the fight and can only attempt to fight back with personal insults. Sad that some people are like that. They have been fortunate, live in Chelsea, money is no object and it is their God and sod anyone else attitute. Typical Tory I suppose.

Hi Mel
yes i cannot agree more with you. its down hill all the way from now on. I think all the Tory supports will just get more and more bitter as the last years roll away Mel. what we will start to see now is more signs of Tory infighting as they look to see who will take over form Cameron. not that they will say this in the open.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Adele Carlyon on Tue May 01, 2012 4:43 pm

The 301 group are plotting a coup against the 1922 committee, this could get interesting! Razz The young guns are revolting! How soddin true!!! Twisted Evil
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Re: Double dip!

Post by tlttf on Tue May 01, 2012 5:36 pm

About time too Adele. Just for the record I'm not a tory neither am I a troll (shame on you Ivan). The ex *anker and Ivan continuously ignore any opinion other than that prescribed by what ever left journal they troll through, occasionally lifting there heads to glance at the Guardian. Free thinking is not on the agenda and all that don't tow the party line will be attacked and vilified until they either can't be bothered to vote or put on the rose tinted glasses that both possess.

Unfortunately Liebor do not offer a viable alternative (though sadly one is needed) after all the gods you follow are the self same ones that started the rot.

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Re: Double dip!

Post by oftenwrong on Tue May 01, 2012 5:42 pm

better the devil you know

something that you say to mean it is better to deal with a person or thing you know, even if you do not like them, than to deal with a new person or thing who could be even worse.
e.g. I know Mike can be difficult to work with sometimes, but better the devil you know.

Cambridge Idioms Dictionary, 2nd ed.


http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/better+the+devil+you+know
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Ivan on Tue May 01, 2012 7:59 pm

tlttf wrote:-
I'm not a tory
No, you just vote for them.

neither am I a troll
You are when you try and provoke one of our moderators with libel about him being sacked from his job.

Free thinking is not on the agenda
It is on the left. From those who aren't brainwashed by the Tory-dominated media and can see the corporate fascism that's being played out by what's probably the most corrupt government the UK's ever had. Try reading 'The Shock Doctrine' by Naomi Klein and it might just open your eyes to what's going on, though I doubt it.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Mel on Tue May 01, 2012 8:41 pm

tlttf Wrote "I'm not a tory "

You confirmed to me on the MSN forum before it closed that you finally decided, having sat on the political fence for months, that you voted Tory at the last election.

You also contradicted yourself (nothing new) by saying on the one hand you voted Tory purely on your local constituency basis and yet on the other you said you would vote for whichever parties manifesto suited you.

So if you're not a Tory then, what the bloody hell are you except a 'sod you Jack I'm alright' specimen?
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Thu May 03, 2012 2:21 am

Red Cat Woman wrote: I am not totally up on his issue. but what happens if France elects a left wing government? will this change the make up of how this silly policy is seen in Europe as a whole?

Hi RWC
In short yes. France will change its economic policy I believe. as the currant policy is failing, its my view they will try to mix cuts and an economic fiscal growth policy together. something we should of done two whole years ago. the fact is Cameron would sell his mother for one 1% of Browns growth he had. but cannot now do that. as he has locked himself into a failed economic policy that he cannot now be seen to walk away from RWC

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Thu May 03, 2012 2:39 am

Ivan wrote:
tlttf wrote:-
I'm not a tory
No, you just vote for them.

neither am I a troll
You are when you try and provoke one of our moderators with libel about him being sacked from his job.

Free thinking is not on the agenda
It is on the left. From those who aren't brainwashed by the Tory-dominated media and can see the corporate fascism that's being played out by what's probably the most corrupt government the UK's ever had. Try reading 'The Shock Doctrine' by Naomi Klein and it might just open your eyes to what's going on, though I doubt it.

Hi Ivan
I thought Maggot and the Gray man was bad. but this lot would sell there own mothers for a corporate buck. its like a sort of in built corrupt we face today. i find myself wondering what the next corrupt act will pop out next. its just so amazing its hard to keep up with it all.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Thu May 03, 2012 3:02 am

Adele Carlyon wrote:The 301 group are plotting a coup against the 1922 committee, this could get interesting! Razz The young guns are revolting! How soddin true!!! Twisted Evil

Hi Adele
do you know what? if they hold on to Doris tonight that is a good as it will get if you ask me. as after that its down hill all the way from here on it. there economy is shoot away. There unemployment is like a run away train and there borrowing to make up for no real growth. on top of that there spending there time selling dinners to there City of London friend for free ha ha if you believe that one. while helping News corp with insider trading info. or not if you happen to believe Cameron. the bottom line is it game up. but what we will now watch is Tory s get more and more dirty with the media with its lies about the Labour party. you watch them go now.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Thu May 03, 2012 12:41 pm

Hi Stox16.

Hollande has said that austerity measures are not working and proposes another course. I saw your post prediction in what he could do, and understand that.

IF he wins and relaxes austerity measures would this not send a message to the Spanish, Greeks, Italians etc that they are suffering badly, and why should they. I understand France is in a stronger position economically but human nature being what it is, if I lived in one of those countries I might be aggrieved.

Personally I don't see the Eurozone surviving as it is.

We have a European Parliament who want a 7% rise in expenditure when most of Europe is struggling. How unreal is this. We give £10b to the monetary fund. We are told it is money well spent and we will get interest on it. When? 20 years time?

But then, what do I know. Like Europe, I'm stone raving bonkers.Embarassed
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Fri May 04, 2012 5:31 am

trevorw2539 wrote:Hi Stox16.

Hollande has said that austerity measures are not working and proposes another course. I saw your post prediction in what he could do, and understand that.

IF he wins and relaxes austerity measures would this not send a message to the Spanish, Greeks, Italians etc that they are suffering badly, and why should they. I understand France is in a stronger position economically but human nature being what it is, if I lived in one of those countries I might be aggrieved.

Personally I don't see the Eurozone surviving as it is.

We have a European Parliament who want a 7% rise in expenditure when most of Europe is struggling. How unreal is this. We give £10b to the monetary fund. We are told it is money well spent and we will get interest on it. When? 20 years time?

But then, what do I know. Like Europe, I'm stone raving bonkers.Embarassed

Hi Trevor
Well Hollande is facing up to the very fact that it does not work without any GDP Growth policy that runs along side it. lets first of all remember a well used Tory party business mans saying. 'You have to spend money to make money' its a saying the currant Tory leadership seems to of forgot. you're question is a wise one. but remember this Trevor. many in Spain, Greece and Italy already question this economic policy. what is starting to happen thank god is Government are starting to remember some of the painful lessons of the 1930s and what FDR did. also they are seeing that the US has taken a very diffrent economic path and are seeing signs of Growth. this we cannot not see at all can we? So Hollande will win in France and he will marry together the two polices and kick start the French economy. yes the banks will jump up and down as they did in the US. but who has come out of top? I would say the US people and there economy.

So yes there is a risk. but to be truthful, we you be very happy to live in Spain, Greece or Italy running a failed economic policy with just more borrowing with no real growth. I think not. so its time to end this utter economic madness that is stopping real GDP growth across the EU. as all we are doing is digging an even bigger hole than we have just left.

as for European Parliament expenditure? a good question once more. in short No it should not rise at this time. in fact it should only rise at the level of EU GDP. Or a per cent of it.

Will the EU stay? well Trevor i have to say it will. Why? because government do not spend billions of Euro to then walk away from it? would you? No. will it change yes but not now.

this may not be the answer you wish to hear but its the best i can come up with at this mo. but let me think some more on this for you. OK
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Fri May 04, 2012 7:52 pm

Stox16. Thanks. I have no particular answer in mind. My only thoughts are how other countries will take to any French relaxation of austerity. And how Merkel would take losing her lapdog, Sarkozy. I can't see Hollande 'cosying up' to her.Smile

Will the EU stay? I actually meant will the Euro currency survive.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Fri May 04, 2012 8:16 pm

Anybody seen the headlines in the Express today? Don't take it but read it while in the supermarket.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/318045/EU-plot-to-scrap-Britain
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Re: Double dip!

Post by oftenwrong on Fri May 04, 2012 8:18 pm

trevorw2539 wrote:Stox16. [color=black]Thanks....

Will the EU stay? I actually meant will the Euro currency survive.

If the Euro currency does NOT survive, practically every Bank whose name you can recognise, together with many others including Central Banks, will take a bath.

2008 will pale into insignificance. I recommend prayer.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Fri May 04, 2012 8:40 pm

oftenwrong wrote:
trevorw2539 wrote:Stox16. [color=black]Thanks....

Will the EU stay? I actually meant will the Euro currency survive.

If the Euro currency does NOT survive, practically every Bank whose name you can recognise, together with many others including Central Banks, will take a bath.

2008 will pale into insignificance. I recommend prayer.

Done:)
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Red Cat Woman on Sat May 05, 2012 2:49 am

[quote="Stox 16"]
trevorw2539 wrote:Hi Stox16.

Hollande has said that austerity measures are not working and proposes another course. I saw your post prediction in what he could do, and understand that.

IF he wins and relaxes austerity measures would this not send a message to the Spanish, Greeks, Italians etc that they are suffering badly, and why should they. I understand France is in a stronger position economically but human nature being what it is, if I lived in one of those countries I might be aggrieved.

Personally I don't see the Eurozone surviving as it is.

We have a European Parliament who want a 7% rise in expenditure when most of Europe is struggling. How unreal is this. We give £10b to the monetary fund. We are told it is money well spent and we will get interest on it. When? 20 years time?

But then, what do I know. Like Europe, I'm stone raving bonkers.Surprised

as for European Parliament expenditure? a good question once more. in short No it should not rise at this time. in fact it should only rise at the level of EU GDP. Or a per cent of it.

What i do not fully understand is why push for this new expenditure now Stox?
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Re: Double dip!

Post by witchfinder on Sun May 06, 2012 11:49 am

I am no economic expert, but I do have some serious doubts about Mr Hollandes economic plans, for a start off his proposals have not been tryed and are very much an experiment; I happen to believe that there is a very fine line between been reckless and reducing the deficit and debt in a sensible, sustainable way which does least harm to the economy and people.

One thing is certain, the deficit must be dealt with, this is as true for France as it is for Britain or any other nation, and some people on the left of politics need to understand this fundamental basic fact.

What Mr Hollande proposes is to rid France of its deficit within 5 years by hitting the very wealthy, closing tax loopholes and taxing banks, but he is also proposing to repeal Sarkozys retirement age legislation, which of course will cost an awful lot of money.

I hope Mr Hollande can do what he says he will do, and if I were French then I would be voting for him, but I would not lay out any money on him succeeding.

The best plan for reducing a national deficit and structual debt that I have read about and studied is the one put forward by Alistair Darling and Gordon Brown, actualy endorsed by the OBR, and endorsed by some of the worlds greatest economists.

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Re: Double dip!

Post by oftenwrong on Sun May 06, 2012 12:01 pm

If a different President of France does what he SAYS he's going to do, the Country will be on strike until Christmas and beyond. As they have done in Spain, and Greece, and Portugal, for similar reasons.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Adele Carlyon on Sun May 06, 2012 2:30 pm

Word has it that Sarkozy is making a last minute comeback, well, according to the torygraph...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/9249073/Turnout-rises-as-Nicolas-Sarkozy-predicts-victory-from-jaws-of-defeat.html
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Re: Double dip!

Post by oftenwrong on Sun May 06, 2012 5:38 pm

Sometimes described as "whistling in the wind".
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Mon May 07, 2012 10:45 am

witchfinder wrote:I am no economic expert, but I do have some serious doubts about Mr Hollandes economic plans, for a start off his proposals have not been tryed and are very much an experiment; I happen to believe that there is a very fine line between been reckless and reducing the deficit and debt in a sensible, sustainable way which does least harm to the economy and people.

One thing is certain, the deficit must be dealt with, this is as true for France as it is for Britain or any other nation, and some people on the left of politics need to understand this fundamental basic fact.

What Mr Hollande proposes is to rid France of its deficit within 5 years by hitting the very wealthy, closing tax loopholes and taxing banks, but he is also proposing to repeal Sarkozys retirement age legislation, which of course will cost an awful lot of money.

I hope Mr Hollande can do what he says he will do, and if I were French then I would be voting for him, but I would not lay out any money on him succeeding.

The best plan for reducing a national deficit and structual debt that I have read about and studied is the one put forward by Alistair Darling and Gordon Brown, actualy endorsed by the OBR, and endorsed by some of the worlds greatest economists.


Hi Witchy
I believe that Hollande win does not signal reckless economics at all and what's more far from it. while I understand the context of your post and would agree with much of what you have written i must just point out a few things.

So as you rightly point out there are some economic experts who mostly sit on the right wing of the political argument who have serious doubts about Hollande's economic policy. in fact these are the very same expert who have in fact been experimenting with extreme economic austerity that has left millions of good hard working people without either jobs or any hope for there families future. What's even more clear is there are many like myself who work in the field of economics who have questioned the whole very idea of an economic policy of austerity by itself. as austerity is not an economic policy is just one small tool within a whole range of other economic tools.

What this one economic austerity tool has done is what it was always going to do, it killed off economic growth and has slowed us down too an economy that has seen us with just 0.2% of GDP. Now the right wing economic experts will argue that what is needed its to cut public sector debt by slashing jobs and that somehow the private sector business will somehow take up all these jobs. That this in turn will lead to less government expenditure and with economic income we should at some point find the so-called balanced budget while cutting our national debt. (has this happened yet..No) well they have had over two whole years of this austerity economic experiment with the net result of both a slow down in GDP with mass unemployment that has left state funding both unemployment while borrowing more money not to invest in the economy.. but to pay for government services and bail out the banking sector at the sacrifice of everything else.

All this utter economic madness has to come to an end and fast. as its heading no where at all. As its not even cutting the national debt and what's worse its killing peoples hopes and adding to business fears. you know there is a very good saying that business men and woman used to say. it goes like this.... YOU HAVE TO SPEND MONEY TO MAKE MONEY

Well I do not know about you? but i happen to believe this is very true saying and has worked over many years. however, this very idea has become a dirty word in right wing economic groups. but WHY?.. as we all know full well that we have to send money to say... get to our work and what's more invest in such things as cars and the like. just like a business man or woman has to invest in plant and people to run it. well it the same goes with governments and economics and yes even debts. as you cannot pay off any of your debts without any sort of income. this is what Hollande fully understands. what he is talking about is a economic policy that has fiscal economic growth policy at its base... and not austerity. As his base line policy. but a growth policy instead to work along side some austerity policies and to cut his national debt in line with what the French economy can handle.

You know Darling was on the right path and what's more I believe has been proven dead right. we both agree with that? well i hope we do? Hollande victory bring with it new hope for and economy based around the 70% of the french people and not the 30% at the top. yes the markets will now attack France....Yes the extreme right will believe this will end the euro.... yes people well say he is running some get economic risk.... but in total truth that said all this about the US economy as well. but where is there economy today? seeing signs of GDP growth. did the credit agencies downgrading crash the US economy? NO

So what are we in fact seeing today then? well a return to real economics based on the management of an economy that uses all the economic tools we have. not this distorted policy of austerity that has left the poor people of Greece hunting for food from cafe bins. No what we have seen over the last 24 hours is a return to a balanced economic policy that will be both sensible and sustainable for the majority of the people and not just the very few at the very top. this is not some crazy tax and spend policy at all, its a real economic policy based around growth not cuts by themselves.

I for one welcome this today. even if there will be many hard battles with right wing economic experts and there City friends. as this gives us in the majority real hope at last.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Adele Carlyon on Mon May 07, 2012 12:10 pm

Great Post Stox! I agree 100% that austerity isn't working. It's cruel and heartless and makes no provision for hard working people or the vulnerable or the sick. It makes me sick to see the top layer being unaffected and in fact getting richer.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by witchfinder on Mon May 07, 2012 4:31 pm

Yes - very good post by stox

What Mr Hollande is proposing is two seperate things, firstly that the French deficit is repaired within 5 years, and secondly to encourage growth by investing in the economy.

Both of these proposals come with a price tag, neither are cheap, but Mr Hollande believes he has the policies and methods to achieve both without squeezing the ordinary Frenchman, and as a great believer in Keynesian economics, I am certain that both goals ARE attainable.

If the deficit is repaired in a sustainable way, then the national debt will automaticly go down, particularly if you can achieve a decent growth rate.
My original point was that there are some who believe that ignoring the government deficit is not important, that it dosent realy matter, or that it is not essential to mend a deficit, but it is.

The more I read about Mr Hollande, the more I like him, the people who are going to pay for putting the French economy back on track are those that have caused the problem in the first place - banks, along with the wealthy and big business.

three cheers for Francois Hollande

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Adele Carlyon on Mon May 07, 2012 5:00 pm

Hip hip hoorah!
Hip hip hoorah!
Hip hip hoorah!
cheers
cheers
cheers
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Mon May 07, 2012 5:05 pm

Noticed on the news a Spanish MP has also agreed with Hollande that austerity is not working and growth must be pursued. Greece has changed. 'Merkel' is not for turning. Gets exciting don't it.
Pity our PM can't/won't see it. Crying or Very sad
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Re: Double dip!

Post by Mel on Mon May 07, 2012 5:18 pm

Con man Cameron has previously snubbed Hollande. I wonder how the two will get along now? No swift "lightweight" visit to Paris for the usual end licking and I suspect a visit will not be iminent.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by oftenwrong on Mon May 07, 2012 5:20 pm

trevorw2539 wrote:Noticed on the news a Spanish MP has also agreed with Hollande that austerity is not working and growth must be pursued. Greece has changed. 'Merkel' is not for turning. Gets exciting don't it.
Pity our PM can't/won't see it. Crying or Very sad

The British tradition is to ignore the Europeans until it's too late for us to extract any advantage from their deliberations.
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Re: Double dip!

Post by trevorw2539 on Mon May 07, 2012 5:33 pm

OW quote
The British tradition is to ignore the Europeans until it's too late for us to extract any advantage from their deliberations.

Ah. That explains 1066 and all that. Smile

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Wed May 09, 2012 3:15 pm

witchfinder wrote:Yes - very good post by stox

What Mr Hollande is proposing is two seperate things, firstly that the French deficit is repaired within 5 years, and secondly to encourage growth by investing in the economy.

Both of these proposals come with a price tag, neither are cheap, but Mr Hollande believes he has the policies and methods to achieve both without squeezing the ordinary Frenchman, and as a great believer in Keynesian economics, I am certain that both goals ARE attainable.

If the deficit is repaired in a sustainable way, then the national debt will automaticly go down, particularly if you can achieve a decent growth rate.
My original point was that there are some who believe that ignoring the government deficit is not important, that it dosent realy matter, or that it is not essential to mend a deficit, but it is.

The more I read about Mr Hollande, the more I like him, the people who are going to pay for putting the French economy back on track are those that have caused the problem in the first place - banks, along with the wealthy and big business.

three cheers for Francois Hollande




This will interest you witchy


Ms. Merkel and her government, fearful of popular resistance in Germany, have made clear in recent weeks that they won't soften their austerity demands embodied in a fiscal pact, a point the German leader reiterated on Monday.

"We in Germany, and me personally, are of the opinion that the fiscal pact is nonnegotiable," Ms. Merkel told reporters at her party's headquarters in Berlin. "I consider the fiscal pact to be right and I think there is a basic process in Europe that we agree that after elections, whether in big countries or little countries, we cannot just put everything up for discussion that was negotiated previously."

But Ms. Merkel said she would "work well" with Mr. Hollande, whom she spoke to for the first time on Sunday night after his election victory. "German-French cooperation is essential for Europe," she said. "Germany will welcome Francois Hollande with open arms. And then we will work together."

The first meeting between the leaders of France and Germany will perhaps be the most crucial in setting the tone for a new chapter in the Franco-German relationship.

GERMAN SOCIALIST CHAIRMAN OF THE SDP BACK HOLLANDE 

However, Sigmar Gabriel, national chairman of the SPD, threw his weight behind Mr Hollande’s demands, after the French Socialist topped the poll in the first round of the presidential election and emerged as the favourite to win a run-off against Nicolas Sarkozy in two weeks’ time.

“François Hollande is absolutely right to say that he will ensure that the fiscal pact is complemented with a growth and employment pact.” Such a programme should be financed by a tax on financial transactions, not by increasing public debt, Mr Gabriel added.

Mr Schockenhoff accused the SPD leader of populist tactics, at a time when the markets needed reassurance about the stability of eurozone government policies.

“If the political will to have a stable fiscal policy is called into question again, we are going to have turbulence,” he warned.

POLL IN GERMANY 

Right Wing CSU is on 33% SDP on 30% with the gap closing 

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Re: Double dip!

Post by Stox 16 on Wed May 09, 2012 4:33 pm

Adele Carlyon wrote:Great Post Stox! I agree 100% that austerity isn't working. It's cruel and heartless and makes no provision for hard working people or the vulnerable or the sick. It makes me sick to see the top layer being unaffected and in fact getting richer.

Thanks Adele
yes we are in full agreement as its very cruel and heartless as this economic so-called policy kills not only GDP it kills working families hope as well. what more its also the destroyer social fabric of the very communities it meant to serve. As we have seen in the likes of Greece, Spain and even here in the UK while adding to a total negative impact on both UK business and investment that is needed at this time and as Adele points out very well leaves the top layer totally unaffected while smash to bits the people who are left behind.

Today's Queens speech does nothing at all to address the issue of having no fiscal growth policy at all. as once more we find 19 more government bills that are mostly based trying to win back middle class voters who are now questioning this very governments total lack of any fiscal growth policy at all. So how ironic it is, that today we are hearing a Queens speech about helping hard working families? Are these the very same hard working families that were over look just one mouth ago in Gideon's budget for the rich 10% of the population of the UK i wonder? Not that any of this is a direct result of last weeks local election results if you happen to believe Cameron. Nor is it too do with deep unrest on his own back benchies if you happen to believe either the Tory party or there friends within the media. No.. all this happens too of came into being because Cameron thinks it would now be nice to help the middle class after dreaming about this in bad one night. ha ha

So where are we after two wasted years of total economic waste. Well I will tell you. We have Cameron in the House of Commons trying in vain to dress up his acrid economic achievement that lasted all of one whole minute, while then repeating the lie about how the last government left the economy. What an utter pile of economic bilge. As can anyone please tell me why after two whole years he is still peddling the same lines that he had when he took office? I.E. (1) its all the fault of the last government, (2) I will be putting the economy first?
Was this not what he said back in 2010?

Yet.. what are all the main media outlets say? well they are talking as if this is somehow all new to them? does not anyone out there have a recording of what this Tory ignoramus said in 2010? well i guess not is the answer.
Well if you are buying into this Queens Speech then all I can say is you must have a very bad memory.

So nothing will change at all.


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Re: Double dip!

Post by oftenwrong on Wed May 09, 2012 5:28 pm

What the Queen's Speech today tells us is that the Tories are satisfied to have achieved most of what they set out to do, two short years ago.

They have opened up the NHS to competition from (non-medical) Private Equity Capital companies. They have decimated the number of workers employed by the State, increased unemployment to emasculate the working-class, and systematically undermined the Benefits system.

Job done!

The quisling Lib-Dems will now be allowed to have a few crumbs to cover their modesty.
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Re: Double dip!

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