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Can God love? (Part 1)

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Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Greatest I am on Wed Apr 25, 2012 9:40 pm

First topic message reminder :

Can God love?

We are told that the mythical bible God is love or the epitome of love.

Archetypal Jesus said that we would know his people by the love, deeds and actions they showed others.

Jesus gave us examples of the deeds and works. Feed the poor, love all our neighbours, do not sin and many others.

Love then, seems to Jesus, to be something that must be shown by deeds, actions and works to be alive and true love. Love, like faith, without works is dead. Both St. James and Jesus agree on this.

It follows then that if God is not doing something to show this love then the love for man expressed in scriptures is wrong and God cannot love.

You are in the image of God. When you love someone you show them that love by works and deeds. This is how the recipient of that love knows it is there and that allows for reciprocity.  You will agree that without reciprocity, true love cannot exist between two individuals. We must do things for each other for true love to exist.

Imagine what those you love would think if you never did anything to express your love. Imagine what you would think of the love of others towards you if they never did anything to show they loved you.  See what I mean. Love always must have deeds to be real and true and reciprocity must be at play.

Love then has no choice but to be expressed if it is true love.

We are told that God loved his son so much that he planned to have him sacrificed even before the earth was created. This human sacrifice or any other human sacrifice, voluntary or not, is immoral and the notion that it is good to sacrifice an innocent victim to give the guilty believers a free ride into heaven is a completely self-gratifying notion and is completely immoral. One does not show love for someone by having them sacrificed for the sins of others when God himself stated that we are all responsible for our own salvation and cannot put that responsibility of the shoulders of a scapegoat Jesus.

Does love need deeds and works to be expressed?

Have you seen God express his love for us lately?

Regards
DL

These following speak to this issue if you wish to view them.

[youtube]



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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Thu May 17, 2012 4:23 pm

Your reply to my quesion regarding blasphemy I could have written myself,
it is a great pity you are not consistant on the basis on which you replied,
throughout.

I have never in any post directly called anyone anything.

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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Greatest I am on Thu May 17, 2012 6:54 pm

polyglide wrote:There is no love greater than that of a NORMAL parent towards their children.

But which NORMAL parent would not chastise their children to show right from wrong.

Chastisement teaches nothing without correction.
Together they have value to the child.
Chastisement by itself just shows the cruelty of the one administering it.

Regards
DL
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Thu May 17, 2012 7:48 pm

But which NORMAL parent would not chastise their children to show right from wrong.
The concept of blasphemy is a religious one. We do not enforce religious laws here.

And you're walking the razor's edge emphasizing the word "normal" in your post. The mistaken belief that you're going to slip something past me will be a fatal one as far as your continued participation here is concerned.
I have never in any post directly called anyone anything.
I can tell when someone is trying to find loopholes in the rules, Polyglide, so keep that in mind the next time you decide to indirectly attack someone. Simply avoiding the use of the person's name is not enough to get you off the hook.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by astra on Thu May 17, 2012 8:09 pm

Chastisement teaches nothing without correction.


I like RoC's take on this -
Constructive,Considered, Corrective Conversation


Kind of like wot Osama got from Seal Team 6
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Fri May 18, 2012 11:43 am

I have never in my life come across such nonsense, why should I not use the word normal, the way I used it concerning parents was to establish that not all parents treat their children as they should, for many reasons many of which are not their fault,

What are you to warn me about next I should not be allowed to tell the truth for heavens sake get a life.

You are adept at taking things completely out of context and it does your immage no good at all. To me at any rate.


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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Ivan on Fri May 18, 2012 12:20 pm

polyglide. On another thread you talk about 'common sense'. In my book that means not trying to provoke the Global Moderator into issuing a permanent ban.

We know your views about homosexuality, so nothing would be achieved by expressing them again, other than to get yourself banned. Perhaps you're just a troll looking for trouble on a forum where the moderation is 'light touch', but if you want to continue posting here I advise you to avoid the subject.

Here's a thought for you. I'm an atheist and don't believe any of the world's religions. As you only believe in one of the faiths, doesn't that make you an atheist (or 'heathen') with regard to all the others?
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Fri May 18, 2012 1:55 pm

doesn't that make you an atheist (or 'heathen') with regard to all the others?

LOL!

As Tosh used to tell the Christians, "You're just one god away from atheism!"
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by astradt1 on Fri May 18, 2012 2:16 pm

Although the title of this thread is "Can God Love" perhaps the question to be asked of our god fearing brothers and sisters is "Does God Love"? If he does how does he show it? Question


Second question.......
Why are/were religious people called 'God Fearing'? :affraid:
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Fri May 18, 2012 4:35 pm

Since I was not allowed to be involved in the homosexual quesion I have never mentioned it in any way.

There are very few people at some time or other who have not heard someone say, look at the way that person is treating the child that cannot be normal, or just look at that person who looks like jumping from the bridge he cannot be normal. etc; It is the matter being discussed that is applicable to the words used and can have no other interpretation.

Unless one is paranoid.



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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Fri May 18, 2012 4:38 pm

God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son to save mankind
can anyone think of a greater love?.



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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by astra on Fri May 18, 2012 5:29 pm

Yeah!


Eric Pickles love for his bacon and egg sandwich!!

Or is that avarice?
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by trevorw2539 on Fri May 18, 2012 5:42 pm

astra wrote:Yeah!


Eric Pickles love for his bacon and egg sandwich!!

Or is that avarice?

Steady on. That's a bit of a rash-er statement.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by oftenwrong on Fri May 18, 2012 5:51 pm

Luckily Eric didn't show up for the feeding of the multitude.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Fri May 18, 2012 8:42 pm

can anyone think of a greater love?

I can.

How about just waving his hand and forgiving us instead of all the claptrap with the blood sacrifice?

God IS omniscient after all ... unless he was playing by someone else's rules.

Or how about not putting the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil inside of Eden in the first place and then cursing all of humanity for a single transgression by one singular human?

When you create a problem just so you can win kudos for solving it ... well ... that's just a bit dishonest.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by trevorw2539 on Fri May 18, 2012 10:13 pm

Shirina quote. When you create a problem just so you can win kudos for solving it ... well ... that's just a bit dishonest

No. No. That's not dishonesty - it's POLITICS.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Sat May 19, 2012 11:30 am

Astra, let us debate any matter without resorting to the kind of remark you have just made, it adds nothing towards the thread, other than the possibility of provoking similar replies.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by astra on Sat May 19, 2012 1:34 pm

DEBATE? all you have come out with are your own proclamations.

Gave his only begotten son, why not his only son?
Then he had him killed horribly and slowly. Not like an axe blow to the neck!
Note that all the miracles stopped there - just stopped


if Abbbots, bishops priests and vicars are the instruments of god, then the miracles would still be happening


So if you can come out with proclamations, any of us can relate the situation as we see it! or do you have 'soul' rights to the thread?
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Mon May 21, 2012 2:45 pm

Oh no they would not, not in the way you suiggest anyway
but believe me there are still miracles happening today but not for the reasons they were originally performed.
Now I do not for one minute think you will understand the following but I will try to make it simple and no doubt as usual you will come back with some smart Alec reply, however, believe me I could bring you down to size with far more comebacks if the thread allowed but I am not interested in anything other than accertaining the truth.

Miracles were originally performed to give those of that time a demonstration to enable them to appreciate that Jesus was the son of God and his actions and testamony was through God

Had Jesus not given the people of that time the evidence of the powers of God they would have only had the word of Jesus to make a decision on and would be in the same state that we would be in if a similar event happened today.

We of the present time have the word of God, Jesus and numerous prophecies that have come to fruition to help us to strenghthren our belief
and faith.

It is just a great pity that some can see no further than the local pub.

.

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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by astra on Mon May 21, 2012 4:52 pm

That post is still just a proclamation!

Oh no who/ what would not?

If the bible is "a living thing" that keeps to time and age, then of course miracles would still be happening.

Hope the pub jibe was NOT aimed at moi! and where did you see the right to cast that character assasinating assumption?

(it is VERY Godly, Absolutely Modern Day christian with a small "c",)
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Mon May 21, 2012 5:49 pm

Miracles were originally performed to give those of that time a demonstration to enable them to appreciate that Jesus was the son of God and his actions and testamony was through God
Oh of course. I mean, Jesus didn't cure the sick and heal the blind because it was the moral and right thing to do. Oh no, that would be too ... Christian. Instead, Jesus was just bragging. "See, look what God can do! Look! Now do you believe?"

I can only assume that once enough people became Christians, it was no longer necessary for miracle healing and such acts ceased.

I suppose that's why God saw fit to part the Red Sea for the Hebrews to deliver them from bondage in Egypt yet sat on his divine laurels all through the Holocaust.

A more proper explanation would be that the number of miracles performed by God is inversely proportional to our scientific knowledge and understanding of our planet. In other words, what was considered a miracle yesterday can be explained today with non-paranormal explanations.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by oftenwrong on Mon May 21, 2012 7:20 pm

If the argument is to be limited to what we UNDERSTAND about God's Will, there's not much to be discussed by mere mortals.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Mon May 21, 2012 7:40 pm

If the argument is to be limited to what we UNDERSTAND about God's Will, there's not much to be discussed by mere mortals.
I've noticed that only Christians seem to understand the will of God. To everyone else, God's will is unfathomable and impossible to understand by mere mortals.

I suppose that means Christians are not mere mortals? confused
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by oftenwrong on Mon May 21, 2012 7:52 pm

I've noticed that only Christians seem to understand the will of God.

Are we to take it that "accept" is a synonym of "understand"?
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Mon May 21, 2012 7:56 pm

Are we to take it that "accept" is a synonym of "understand"?

Just ask people what God meant by this or that and they'll tell you in no uncertain terms. Rarely will they simply say, "I don't really know."

Thus it goes well beyond simply "accepting" God's will ... they seem to "understand" it quite well. I suppose you could say that "understand" is a euphemism for "God wants what I want."
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by oftenwrong on Mon May 21, 2012 8:02 pm

That helps us to understand why the Tories are such shits.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Mon May 21, 2012 8:04 pm

That helps us to understand why the Tories are such shits.

lol!
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Tue May 22, 2012 2:01 pm

There is no doubt whatsoever that the Devil has got many followers even when they are unaware of doing his bidding, he must be laughing his head off.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by oftenwrong on Tue May 22, 2012 5:38 pm

Laughing at you or laughing with you?
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Tue May 22, 2012 8:19 pm

There is no doubt whatsoever that the Devil has got many followers even when they are unaware of doing his bidding, he must be laughing his head off.
Well, after the devil decapitates himself through laughter, we won't have to worry about Ol' Scratch.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Tue May 22, 2012 8:20 pm

Laughing at you or laughing with you?

With ... of course. Cool
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Guest on Wed May 23, 2012 2:19 am

delete


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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Greatest I am on Thu May 24, 2012 6:38 pm

polyglide wrote:God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son to save mankind
can anyone think of a greater love?.


Duh. Ya.

He could have had the balls to fill his own ransom demands. That is what a responsible human father would do.
He would shoe love for his own child over all others.

Then again. We should not expect God to reach the heights of a good human father.

Regards
DL
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Guest on Thu May 24, 2012 7:10 pm

Greek Bible:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but haveeternal life.

John 3:16
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by astradt1 on Thu May 24, 2012 7:29 pm

Greek Bible:
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but haveeternal life.

John 3:16

Adj. begotten - (of offspring) generated by procreation; "naturally begotten child"
biological - of parents and children; related by blood; "biological child"

So Jesus was not the son of Joseph......but the son of god........How can the son of god be related to king david?

Adj. related - connected by kinship.
lineal, direct - in a straight unbroken line of descent from parent to child; "lineal ancestors"; "lineal heirs"; "a direct descendant of the king"; "direct heredity"
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by trevorw2539 on Thu May 24, 2012 10:23 pm

astradt1 wrote:
Greek Bible:
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but haveeternal life.

John 3:16

Adj. begotten - (of offspring) generated by procreation; "naturally begotten child"
biological - of parents and children; related by blood; "biological child"

So Jesus was not the son of Joseph......but the son of god........How can the son of god be related to king david?

Adj. related - connected by kinship.
lineal, direct - in a straight unbroken line of descent from parent to child; "lineal ancestors"; "lineal heirs"; "a direct descendant of the king"; "direct heredity"

The problem with translating old documents written in ancient languages or even dialects is finding a word in another language which matches exactly to ancient word. Often there is no such word, so the nearest is used. Begotten is an old English word. 14th cent.
Several explanations are available as to the above (begotten), depending on your religious - non-religious belief. I have quoted from Wiki. which I hope is neutral. I am not going to get into discussion on the subject, not being a Greek linguist. Just thought I would mention the underlined.
Words, meanings, actions and events are not always explainable after 2000 years. Our understanding, language, likes and dislikes are of a different age. Words have different meanings, even if they are available.

The verse in the original Greek is as follows (associated Strong's Number in superscript):
Οὕτως3779 γὰρ1063 ἠγάπησεν25 ὁ3588 Θεὸς2316 τὸν3588 κόσμον2889, ὥστε5620 τὸν3588 Υἱὸν[3] 5207 τὸν3588 μονογενῆ3439 ἔδωκεν1325, ἵνα2443 πᾶς3956 ὁ3588 πιστεύων4100 εἰς1519 Αὐτὸν846 μὴ3361 ἀπόληται622 ἀλλ᾽235 ἔχῃ2192 ζωὴν2222 αἰώνιον166
This can be translated literally as:
For in this way God loved the world: that he gave the unique son, so that all the ones trusting in him would not perish, but have eternal life.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_3:16
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Guest on Fri May 25, 2012 12:38 am

trevorw2539 wrote:
Greek Bible:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but haveeternal life.

John 3:16
The problem with translating old documents written in ancient languages or even dialects is finding a word in another language which matches exactly to ancient word. Often there is no such word, so the nearest is used.

The verse in the original Greek is as follows (associated Strong's Number in superscript):
Οὕτως3779 γὰρ1063 ἠγάπησεν253588 Θεὸς2316 τὸν3588 κόσμον2889, ὥστε5620 τὸν3588 Υἱὸν[3] 5207 τὸν3588 μονογενῆ3439 ἔδωκεν,1325 ἵνα2443 πᾶς39563588 πιστεύων4100 εἰς1519 Αὐτὸν846 μὴ3361 ἀπόληται622 ἀλλ᾽235 ἔχῃ2192 ζωὴν2222 αἰώνιον.166

This can be translated literally as:
For in this way God loved the world: that he gave the unique son, so that all the ones trusting in him would not perish, but have eternal life.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_3:16

References

  • 3. The word Αὐτὸυ appears after Υἱὸν (son) in the Textus Receptus and the Byzantine text-type, but not the Alexandrian text-type.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_3:16#cite_note-autou-2

__________________________________________________________________________________________
Greek Bible:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten3439 Son,5207 that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but haveeternal life.

John 3:16
__________________________________________________________________________________________


3439, μονογενής, monogenēs, only born, that is, sole, only (begotten, child).

From 3441 and 1096

  • 3441, μόνος, monos, sole or single, alone, only, by themselves.

  • 1096, γίνομαι, ginomai, to cause to be (“gen” -erate), that is, (reflexively) to become (come into being), used with great latitude (literally, figuratively, intensively, etc.): - arise, be assembled, be, become, befall, be brought, brought to pass, become, come to pass, continue, be divided, be done, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled, grow, happen, have, be kept, be made, be married, be ordained to be, partake, pass, be performed, be published, require, seem, be showed, be taken, be turned, be wrought.

5207
υἱός, huios, son, distinguished from teknon, child. Huios principally indicates the relationship between offspring and parents rather than simply the birth of the offspring, as indicated by teknon.

__________________________________________________________________________________________


The KJV New Testament Greek Lexicon

Huios
Strong's Number: 5207

  • Original Word: uiJovß

  • Transliterated Word: Huios

  • Definition: a son, in a restricted sense, the male offspring (one born by a father and of a mother), in a wider sense, a descendant, one of the posterity of any one, the children of Israel, sons of Abraham, used to describe one who depends on another or is his follower, a pupil.

http://www.biblestudytools.com/lexicons/greek/kjv/huios.html


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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by polyglide on Fri May 25, 2012 11:29 am

The one who has the last laugh will not be those whose only response to a quesion is a lot of tripe, I do not laugh at those who have neither sense nor reason, they have my deapest sympathy, the response always in the same vein to anything that they obviouisly do not understand proves that their minds are indeed bemused by the whiles of the Devil and they are too thick to see it.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Ivan on Fri May 25, 2012 5:37 pm

a lot of tripe.....neither sense nor reason......their minds are indeed bemused by the whiles of the Devil....they are too thick to see it
LOL. Can God love? Who knows? But his supporters certainly can!
Evil or Very Mad
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Shirina on Fri May 25, 2012 6:21 pm

Evil or Very Mad <--- Ivan, I do believe you are being seduced by the whiles of the Devil ... just look at that emoticon!
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by Ivan on Fri May 25, 2012 7:15 pm

LOL. Look at this one, Shirina! Twisted Evil
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

Post by oftenwrong on Fri May 25, 2012 8:45 pm

polyglide wrote:-
I do not laugh at those who have neither sense nor reason
How irritating must it be to find oneself surrounded by Pygmies?
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)

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