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The Leveson Inquiry

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The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Blamhappy on Thu May 31, 2012 10:01 am

First topic message reminder :

I know it's a it late, but I'm starting the thread because Jeremy Hunt gives evidence from 10 this morning and this could be explosive.

Someone I follow on Twitter believes that Hunt might resign soon after giving evidence. How will this affect the evidence he gives (will he be braver?)? How will all this impact on David Cameron? What will be the general knock-on effect?

I think we could also discuss other aspects of the "hacking scandal" in general here too. Let's include discussion on Andy Coulson, who was charged last night with Perjury in relation to his court case in 2010.

It's quite exciting if you're sad like me Smile
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Adele Carlyon on Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:12 am

So it's Cleggy Liars turn this morning. The trouble is that no one is interested in anything that comes out of his lick spittle gob! I can't take anyone seriously who had someone elses hand up their bum!

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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by sickchip on Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:17 am

Adele Carlyon wrote:So it's Cleggy Liars turn this morning. The trouble is that no one is interested in anything that comes out of his lick spittle gob! I can't take anyone seriously who had someone elses hand up their bum!
Very Happy

That'll be Cameron hiding under the desk operating the puppet then.... Smile
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:01 am

So far, it appears that , in response to questions, Clegg has managed about 78 'Ums' and 57 'Ers'.

Scintillating stuff which has many of those unlucky enough to be present fighting to stay awake, and others seemingly writing letters to maiden aunts while waiting for the faltering and hesitant Clugg to conclude his vital evidence which will be of no value to Lord Leveson in any way.

Apart from that, the Deputy PM (and Glove-Puppet-in-Chief) is doing a splendid job in ensuring that, by comparison, His Master's Voice Cameron can only look good tomorrow...


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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Adele Carlyon on Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:09 am

I simply can't put into words how strong the urge is that I have to smack the smarmy git in the chops! Grrrrrr
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:13 am

It would only be fair to try, given that we had somebody attempting to have a pot shot at Blair last week...... Very Happy
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Adele Carlyon on Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:16 am

He's not worth me getting a criminal record! He's nowt but a lacky! Wink Tempting tho! lol
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:23 am

I suppose asking you to send a strongly-worded letter to him asserting that he is an unprincipled cad and bounder and should have his trousers lowered, and his private parts dipped in treacle, is also out of the question?

Thought so.... Crying or Very sad
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Adele Carlyon on Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:32 am

If I wrote him a letter it wouldn't be the longest ltter in the world!

Dear Nick.
You are a tit.
Love me xxx
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by astra on Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:52 pm

unprincipled cad and bounder and should have his trousers lowered, and his private parts dipped in treacle,

You missed the bit that says..............


Then thrown naked onto a red ant's nest!!


Tsk Tsk
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:20 pm

I had taken that as read, Mr Astra.

Incidentally ,what other such rituals did they hold at your alma mater...? Very Happy
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Wed Jun 13, 2012 5:24 pm

"Tom Brown's Schooldays" is the fagging equivalent of Wisden.

http://www.literature.org/authors/hughes-thomas/tom-browns-schooldays/
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:10 pm

I wonder how good old Tom would have fared today at 'Rugby Academy ' (sponsored by News International),,,,?
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by astra on Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:19 pm

Incidentally ,what other such rituals did they hold at your alma mater...?

Heh!

Tossing the caber, carrying a barrel of Whisky up the Glen, drinking the contents, then climbing in the barrel and roll back agin - person who can get out unaided, stand up and recite pythagorus therum in the quickest time the winner.

It was ALL character forming stuff. Makes us what we are yi' know!! drunken drunken


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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:32 pm

The absence of any mention of Latin, the School Song, or injuries soothed by Matron, suggests that this was not a seat of learning with any true tradition.

I still bear the scars of my 'induction' - which involved a prickly hedge and liquid soap...... Shocked
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:48 pm

Is there too much levity surrounding the Leveson Enquiry?
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by astra on Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:52 pm

Is there too much levity surrounding the Leveson Enquiry?



Sod Leveson, I want the Spanish Inquisition!

Is our resident minister a Dominican perhaps?? Shocked :affraid:
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Mel on Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:52 am

Cameron up next. He knows the questions that will be asked and has had time and the advise of his aides brief him. On to of that we will get the same side stepping of difficult questions just as Clegg, Hunt and Osborne have done. No point IMO expecting Cameron to fall upon his sword and not much point in this farce of an enquiry.

Cleggs management, abstention all round was the shrewdest way to avoid declaring war on the Conservatives regarding the vote in the house yesterday.
Clegg will do ANYTHING to stay in power for as long as possible as he knows he and his party are finished. Having said that, it would be no surprise to me to see him ultimately to change sides over to the Tories, after all he's almost there now.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by trevorw2539 on Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:02 am

Mel. quote

Clegg will do ANYTHING to stay in power for as long as possible as he knows he and his party are finished. Having said that, it would be no surprise to me to see him ultimately to change sides over to the Tories, after all he's almost there now.

Crikey. Don't inflict more problems on the Tories. They've got enough now. Oh, I don't know though. Smile
New tragic comedy duo? 'Cough and Splutter'. Guaranteed to send you into paroxysms of laughter or rage. Smile
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:19 am

Clegg isn't a closet Tory, but in any case would have little hope of advancement within that Party. I confidently expect that a comfortable seat in the Brussells hog-pit is being kept warm for him.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Mel on Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:08 pm

Looks like they ALL come out of the Leveson Inquiry unscathed. No more so than Cameron, sweaky clean performance so far at half way. Not bothering to watch the rest of it as Robert Jay QC is so boring and fails to impress me with his questioning.
I was amazed to hear Lord Justice Leveson actually asking Cameron for "advise" on certain matters of government and other matters which all went to make Cameron look confident and genuine. Even Jay was not IMO pressing Dave very much on any of the issues it was more like a teaching lesson for the Inquiry members by Cameron.
There was a tremendous amount of agreeing going on both from Leveson and Jay towards Cameron, so much so that smiles were abundant at times. When one learns how Cameron prepared for his turn for questioning, it is not surprising that he comes out squeaky clean because every question to be asked of him the answers had been prevously scripted for him by experts at the taxpayers expense would you credit?

Feldman, a close friend from the Prime Minister's Oxford University days, who was made co-chairman of the Conservative party as a reward for campaigning for Cameron to become leader.

Feldman, a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity, has been acting the part of Leveson's QC, Robert Jay, to prepare Cameron for awkward questions about his friendship with Rebekah Brooks and his reasons for hiring Andy Coulson as his communications director.

He has also taken the advice of two leading lawyers at the taxpayers' expense, according to Daily Mail political hack, Tim Shipman, although they were not involved in 'prepping' the PM. They are Paul Jenkins, the Treasury solicitor, and an unnamed QC.

The BBC were quick to point out that this is just and enquiry and not a criminal court hearing. Cameron made a meal of the fact that the government only "froze" the TV licence fee instead of increasing it as Murdoch would liked to have seen happen. By doing so helping to distance himself from being seen to be pro Murdoch's Empire.

I get the impression that Leveson himself is grateful to Cameron for bringing in this enquiry for Leveson's purse must be huge and all at our expense to boot. Hence the polte engagement and the frequent smiles afforded the con man throughout.
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Additional FOI request: Leveson coaching - whose time was it on?

Post by skwalker1964 on Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:24 pm

From my blog skwalker1964.wordpress.com:

I’ve just submitted the following additional request to the Cabinet office regarding coaching sessions for Cameron & co for their Leveson testimony:

Dear Cabinet Office,

I require to know the following information, please:

1) How many hours David Cameron and other ministers have spent in
preparation and coaching (or refamiliarisation, to use Mr Cameron’s
term) for their testimony to the Leveson enquiry. This information
to be listed by individual minister.

2) The dates, along with start and end times, of any such sessions.

Yours faithfully,

Steve Walker

Since the Prime Minister and his ministers don’t need preparation to be able to tell the truth, but merely to prevent personal and/or party political damage, any coaching should be outside of their working hours as members of the government. Especially since those hours are, by their own admission, quite limited anyway.

Of course, there remain the massive questions of why they need coaching if they’re simply going to tell the truth, of who carried it out, and of who has paid for this preparation, legal fees etc. It certainly shouldn’t be the British taxpayer. But those are covered by the earlier Freedom of Information request.

I’ll keep you updated as I hear anything.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by skwalker1964 on Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:28 pm

I've just posted separately about an FOI request about Leveson coaching - then realised I should have put it in here. Hopefully a moderator will move it over!
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by skwalker1964 on Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:32 pm

Mel wrote:Looks like they ALL come out of the Leveson Inquiry unscathed. No more so than Cameron, sweaky clean performance so far at half way. Not bothering to watch the rest of it as Robert Jay QC is so boring and fails to impress me with his questioning.
I was amazed to hear Lord Justice Leveson actually asking Cameron for "advise" on certain matters of government and other matters which all went to make Cameron look confident and genuine. Even Jay was not IMO pressing Dave very much on any of the issues it was more like a teaching lesson for the Inquiry members by Cameron.
There was a tremendous amount of agreeing going on both from Leveson and Jay towards Cameron, so much so that smiles were abundant at times. When one learns how Cameron prepared for his turn for questioning, it is not surprising that he comes out squeaky clean because every question to be asked of him the answers had been prevously scripted for him by experts at the taxpayers expense would you credit?

Feldman, a close friend from the Prime Minister's Oxford University days, who was made co-chairman of the Conservative party as a reward for campaigning for Cameron to become leader.

Feldman, a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity, has been acting the part of Leveson's QC, Robert Jay, to prepare Cameron for awkward questions about his friendship with Rebekah Brooks and his reasons for hiring Andy Coulson as his communications director.

He has also taken the advice of two leading lawyers at the taxpayers' expense, according to Daily Mail political hack, Tim Shipman, although they were not involved in 'prepping' the PM. They are Paul Jenkins, the Treasury solicitor, and an unnamed QC.

The BBC were quick to point out that this is just and enquiry and not a criminal court hearing. Cameron made a meal of the fact that the government only "froze" the TV licence fee instead of increasing it as Murdoch would liked to have seen happen. By doing so helping to distance himself from being seen to be pro Murdoch's Empire.

I get the impression that Leveson himself is grateful to Cameron for bringing in this enquiry for Leveson's purse must be huge and all at our expense to boot. Hence the polte engagement and the frequent smiles afforded the con man throughout.

My initial FOI request to his office asks for details of the coaching received by Cameron and his ministers, who provided it and who paid. It also asks whether any non-government people were coached at taxpayers expense and for details of communications regarding Leveson preparation.

As the ministers don't need coaching to simply tell the truth, but rather to avoid incriminating themselves personally and to avoid party political damage, under no circumstances is it a justifiable public expense. We'll see what response I get - they may dodge it, but that will tell its own story.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by trevorw2539 on Thu Jun 14, 2012 4:53 pm

Skywalker quote. Since the Prime Minister and his ministers don’t need preparation to be able to tell the truth, but merely to prevent personal and/or party political damage, any coaching should be outside of their working hours as members of the government. Especially since those hours are, by their own admission, quite limited anyway.

And you can remember dates, times and conversations that you have had over the last 7 years. Meetings you have attended. The agendas for those meetings, and their outcomes.
He is human, and his name is Cameron - not Leslie Welsh - who, if you remember was known as the Memory man.

Much as I dislike his policies even he needs some refreshing. If he hadn't had notice of the topics the whole Inquiry would last till Doomsday, waiting for someone to come and bring relevant diaries and records for him to look up every time he couldn't remember.

This is an inquiry, not a trial. As long as the evidence is correct, that is all that matters. It's then up to Leveson to make his recommendations, not to find anyone guilty of a crime.

What about the opposition leaders who gave testimony. You only mention 'the Prime minister and his ministers'. Is it OK for the others, and those who aren't even MP's now, should they be allowed to 'gen' up on their testimony.

That's what I like about Cuttingedge2 so left wing Smile

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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Mel on Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:03 pm

Hello SKW,

I shall leave the transfer of your post to Blamhappy in this case my friend.

The BBC News is stating that Cameron was made "uncomfortable" with the questioning. What utter rubbish, he had an easy ride and was allowed to encompass Political party gain in some respects with his boastings and he managed to snipe at Gordon Browns comments slating the man off. The content of that you will see in the media news or the press no doubt.

Overall Cameron came out on top. So much for QC's and Lord's Of Justice, weak and IMO quite surprisingly gullible.

I agree -"they may dodge it, but that will tell its own story." Indeed it will SK but to whom? us here on these threads, but not to the masses where it would matter most eh?
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Mel on Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:13 pm

The bastards "dodge" everything and anything and if by some pure chance they can't they worm or flannel their way out. I bet they have found a clause in parlimentary proceedure where the taxpayer foots the bill in these circumstances.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:33 pm

Entrapment rarely coincides with Justice. I too like to see lying swine nailed, but not at the cost of fair-dealing.

Everyone is entitled to know what they are accused of, the identity of their Accuser, and ample opportunity to prepare a Defence.

The Robespierre doctrine of guilty uintil proved innocent will usually backfire in English Law, and rightly so.

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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:37 pm

QUOTE: " a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity" UNQUOTE

Don't look now, Mel, but your prejudice is showing.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Blamhappy on Thu Jun 14, 2012 5:54 pm

skwalker1964 wrote:I've just posted separately about an FOI request about Leveson coaching - then realised I should have put it in here. Hopefully a moderator will move it over!

I don't actually know how, so I'm just doing a copy and paste.

"From my blog skwalker1964.wordpress.com:

I’ve just submitted the following additional request to the Cabinet office regarding coaching sessions for Cameron & co for their Leveson testimony:

Dear Cabinet Office,

I require to know the following information, please:

1) How many hours David Cameron and other ministers have spent in
preparation and coaching (or refamiliarisation, to use Mr Cameron’s
term) for their testimony to the Leveson enquiry. This information
to be listed by individual minister.

2) The dates, along with start and end times, of any such sessions.

Yours faithfully,

Steve Walker

Since the Prime Minister and his ministers don’t need preparation to be able to tell the truth, but merely to prevent personal and/or party political damage, any coaching should be outside of their working hours as members of the government. Especially since those hours are, by their own admission, quite limited anyway.

Of course, there remain the massive questions of why they need coaching if they’re simply going to tell the truth, of who carried it out, and of who has paid for this preparation, legal fees etc. It certainly shouldn’t be the British taxpayer. But those are covered by the earlier Freedom of Information request.

I’ll keep you updated as I hear anything."
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Thu Jun 14, 2012 6:40 pm

Purely in the interests of symmetry, you understand, my response to the original posting may now also be read here too. Here it was:

Re: Additional FOI request: Leveson coaching - whose time was it on?
by oftenwrong Today at 5:33 pm

.Entrapment rarely coincides with Justice. I too like to see lying swine nailed, but not at the cost of fair-dealing.

Everyone is entitled to know what they are accused of, the identity of their Accuser, and ample opportunity to prepare a Defence.

The Robespierre doctrine of guilty uintil proved innocent will usually backfire in English Law, and rightly so.


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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:14 pm

There was never any prospect that Cameron would be 'caught out' at Leveson. When in a tight spot, it is open to the likes of him to simply 'not be able to remember'. What will be more telling for the slippery Premier is just how many of the British public believe he is entirely innocent of any wrongdoing, and how many are convinced he is one of the biggest and shadiest crooks this nation's politics has ever seen.

It does not take a genius to hold a coherent view that something is rotten in the State of Westminster and that a smell of corruption may well emanate from 10 Downing Street and the neighbour.

However frustrating it may be that Cameron seems to be 'getting away with it', his day of reckoning will come - we can be sure of that, so keep the bunting handy....
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:18 pm

Cameron may live to regret his "I don't recall anything such as that" response to so many questions.

Should further evidence in the matter emerge at some time in the future, he won't be able to challenge it or even comment with any credibility.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by astra on Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:27 pm

I fail to understand that Cameron does not have a diarist recording all that is said

Think of Tony Benn MP and his memoirs, conversations and feellings and "nuances" of what he deduced, all lined up in his books


Cameron may live to regret his "I don't recall anything such as that" response to so many questions
.

By his own hand, Cameron has cut his "Memoirs" down to the size of a Football League match programme!





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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Mel on Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:26 am

Predudice --- An adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge
or examination of the facts.


"your prejudice is showing." Thanks OW Smile Embarassed

"Feldman, a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity," FACT.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by skwalker1964 on Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:29 am

trevorw2539 wrote:Skywalker quote. Since the Prime Minister and his ministers don’t need preparation to be able to tell the truth, but merely to prevent personal and/or party political damage, any coaching should be outside of their working hours as members of the government. Especially since those hours are, by their own admission, quite limited anyway.

And you can remember dates, times and conversations that you have had over the last 7 years. Meetings you have attended. The agendas for those meetings, and their outcomes.
He is human, and his name is Cameron - not Leslie Welsh - who, if you remember was known as the Memory man.

Much as I dislike his policies even he needs some refreshing. If he hadn't had notice of the topics the whole Inquiry would last till Doomsday, waiting for someone to come and bring relevant diaries and records for him to look up every time he couldn't remember.

This is an inquiry, not a trial. As long as the evidence is correct, that is all that matters. It's then up to Leveson to make his recommendations, not to find anyone guilty of a crime.

What about the opposition leaders who gave testimony. You only mention 'the Prime minister and his ministers'. Is it OK for the others, and those who aren't even MP's now, should they be allowed to 'gen' up on their testimony.

That's what I like about Cuttingedge2 so left wing Smile


He could bring his diary in and refer to it. Not that hard - or his wife's since she keeps a better one. Doesn't need hours and hours.

And your point's flawed. If someone asked me what a text or email I'd sent was about, I'd have a pretty good idea even 7 years later. He's not being asked to recite events in order, he's being asked mostly about what he meant by a particular email.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by skwalker1964 on Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:36 am

oftenwrong wrote:Purely in the interests of symmetry, you understand, my response to the original posting may now also be read here too. Here it was:

Re: Additional FOI request: Leveson coaching - whose time was it on?
by oftenwrong Today at 5:33 pm

.Entrapment rarely coincides with Justice. I too like to see lying swine nailed, but not at the cost of fair-dealing.

Everyone is entitled to know what they are accused of, the identity of their Accuser, and ample opportunity to prepare a Defence.

The Robespierre doctrine of guilty uintil proved innocent will usually backfire in English Law, and rightly so.

The point of the FOI request isn't that they can't prepare (though I think if they were simply going to tell the truth, they wouldn't need much prep). It's that if they do prepare, it should be on their own time and not ours. The preparation is for self-protection and party protection. Not for the good of the British people. So we shouldn't be footing the bill.

The original request is aimed at finding out whether the taxpayer has paid for non-govt individuals to be coached, and to find out who was doing it. 'Refamiliarisation' needs a few civil servants going through correspondence to refresh the memory. It doesn't need lawyers, and it doesn't need PR firms. That's spin and damage-limitation, and they should pay for that from their own or their party's funds.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by oftenwrong on Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:19 am

Mel wrote:Predudice --- An adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge
or examination of the facts.


"your prejudice is showing." Thanks OW Smile Embarassed

"Feldman, a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity," FACT.



A fact relevant to the discussion, or gratuitously inserted for some unconnected purpose?

Just askin'
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Mel on Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:28 pm

OW Quote--"just asking"

Your prerogative sir and i'm happy to oblige.

Feldman, a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity and close friend of Cameron. The very fact that he is Jewish is not the issue. It is IMO
that this friendship is relevent to the inquiry because again it shows that Cameron is all for the rich business people of any creed not just a Jewish businessman as in this case. You scratch my back and I will scratch yours.

It reinforces the allegations that Cameron was close and assisting Murdoch via Hunt or in any way he could without being detected. Of course the fact that Murdoch is an Australian is as academic as Feldman is Jewish. The point is they are both powerful business men who Cameron has got too close to. Too close it may prove to be at the end of this inquiry.
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Scarecrow on Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:14 pm

After having being in self exile from this forum , it was very amusing to see how inane some of the posts have gotten and how low brow they are . Certain forum members have become even more right wing since I last properly perused and read at any depth.
The reason I have comited fingers to qwerty keyboard is for one reason ,

Oftenwrong , "your prejudice is showing."

Mel , Feldman, a leading member of the Jewish business fraternity and close friend of Cameron.

My post regarding Jewish Congressmen in the US government received zero replies.
This told me that the subject was taboo and gave me a greater insight into how shallow and weak forum members were, not to have any informed comment on the subject was breathtaking , then again not .

http://cuttingedge2.forumotion.co.uk/t440-why-does-the-united-states-allow-israeli-citizens-to-sit-in-congress
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by astra on Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:36 pm

Hello Scarecrow,

I now avoid, or try to, subjects along the Jewish lines, as some see fit, for some reason - maybe they think they are being humerous, I have no idea. Or do they think they are being serious, to put themselves forward as the Politically Correct Police. It has happened too often, so I merely observe, till I see a quiet way to join the discussion.

why does the united states .....................
Because since Adolf's antics the doors have been closed and there is nothing we can do about it.

Our own Parliament has many Jews, would they fight for this country?
We have people elected to Government, hailing from a small rock that sits off of Angelsey, who have never sworn allegiance to the Queen, yet still accept their MP's wages.

are the foundations of BOTH our societys being eroded, AND is this the desired effect?

Would the Jews in Congress, iffin they were born in the US be permitted to take Presidential Office?
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

Post by Phil Hornby on Fri Jun 15, 2012 7:40 pm

Meanwhile, the Civil Servant who was unable to find evidence to undermine Gordon Brown's testimony at Leveson regarding official 'phone calls to Rupert Murdoch is, nonetheless, thanked for his efforts by one of Cameron's 'advisers'...
(msn)
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Re: The Leveson Inquiry

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