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The best ways to deal with ........

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The best ways to deal with ........

Post by toty5 on Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:09 am

Children are special people. They have their own identity. Our beloved Prophet Muhammad (  peace be upon him) showed this through his behavior. He loved children and was always compassionate and merciful towards them. He showed his affection for them in many ways. He hugged them and patted them on the back. He touched their
heads, combing their hair with his fingers.

He liked to hold little children in his arms. He made funny faces (like pulling his tongue out) to please them. When lying down he seated them on his legs or chest.

The Prophet Muhammad (  peace be upon him) loved to play with children. He made them stand in a straight line, then he himself stood at a distance, spread his hands and told the children, “Come running to me. Whoever touches me first will get a prize,” they would all come, running and breathless. When they reached the Prophet (  peace be upon him), they would fall all over him. He enjoyed this sport, gave prizes of dates and sweets to the winners and hugged and kissed the participants.

He used to kiss children and loved them very much. Once he was kissing children when a Bedouin came and said, "You love children very much. I have ten children and I have never kissed one of them." Muhammad replied, "What can I do if God takes away love from you?".

The Prophet Muhammad ( peace be upon him ) was always pleased to see parents loving and caressing their children. He once said, “When Allah blesses people with children, and they give their children love and meet their parental obligation, Allah keeps them safe from the fires of Hell.”

Jabir bin Samra, one of his companions, reported an incident of his childhood. "Once I offered the prayer with God's Messenger. After the prayer, when he went towards his house, I went with him. We were joined by more boys, and he kissed them all and me too." When Prophet Mohammad SAW was entering the town of Medinah, after emigrating from Makkah, some young girls of the Ansar were singing with joy in front of their houses. When he passed by, he said, "O girls! You love me." All said, "Yes, O God's Messenger." Then he said, "I love you also.”

Yusuf bin Abdullah said that when he was born his parents took him to God's Messenger for his blessing; he suggested the name, Yusuf, and put him in his lap. He patted him on the head and prayed for the
Blessings of God for him.'

Whenever the Prophet Muhammad ( peace be upon him ) passed by children, he tried to be the first to greet them and say “Assalaamu Alaikum.” When riding he would let children sit on his camel or donkey.

When children saw him, they came running. He greeted them warmly, picked them up, hugged them and kissed them. He loved giving them dates, fruits and sweets to eat.

In some prayers, the Prophet ( peace be upon him) read long Surahs. But if he heard a baby crying, he would read a short Surah and say a short prayer. This helped the mother to take care of her baby.

He used to get into the spirit of childish games in their company. He would have fun with the children who had come back from Abyssinia and tried to speak in Abyssinian with them. It was his practice to give lifts on his camel to children when he returned from journeys.

Among the instructions given before the conquest of Makkah, one of the important ones was not to harm any child. Prophet  peace be upon him was worried for their safety and wellbeing even at a state of war. This shows the compassion he had towards children no matter what the situation was.
Lessons from Seerah of Prophet  peace be upon him: Raising good
Children

Today we are inundated with masses of statistics, books, researches, psychological studies, and ‘notice of caution’ in relation on how to raise successful, happy children, children with great self-esteem, most productive adults and the alike.

In recent times access to all this information is just a ‘click’ away. Needless to say each lesson taught us by The Prophet was a valuable one full of wisdom. He educated us so as not to overlook even the smallest of things, He taught us the beauty incumbent in the ability to love, how to melt away all adversity with a merciful touch, and amongst many of the most wonderful things that He has taught us is that loving your child comes for free and simple. We have described all that we could find on how to achieve outstanding results in raising good children now it is upon us to practice all that we have learnt and shape the humanity in the most beautiful way.

Watch this Amazing Video
His Treatment with Children

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUiUriDr9Pk

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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by oftenwrong on Tue Apr 01, 2014 11:51 am

The norms of human behaviour two thousand years ago (or even fifty years ago) have been distorted by contemporary society. A strange man embracing a child in 2014 is a rare sight, and probably not without repercussion.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by Dan Fante on Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:23 am

He liked little kids so much he married one.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by boatlady on Thu Apr 03, 2014 4:31 pm

That was quite a sweet video, I thought - the little boy looked as if he was having a very nice time
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by oftenwrong on Thu Apr 03, 2014 5:17 pm

To the Pure, all things are pure.

Titus 1:15.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by toty5 on Fri Apr 04, 2014 8:10 pm

Dan Fante wrote:He liked little kids so much he married one.
 
- It was not the Holy Prophet peace be upon him is the first suitors to her, but was engaged "to bin Jubair restaurant " , which shows the maturity and completeness of femininity
 
- Were not his sermon, peace be upon him it is not the desire of his own , but was proposing "to Khawla girl wise" to the Prophet - peace be upon him - ; so as to consolidate the link with the love of his companions , which Abu Bakr, may Allah be pleased with him , and when he suggested they think they are suitable for marriage and filling the vacuum after the death of Khadija God bless them .
 
- Of medically known that puberty in the tropics will be faster than in the less heat . May reach puberty when girls in the tropics to 8 or 9 years old.
 
Says Dr " Duschna " - an American female doctor - "The white girl in America could begin in adulthood when the seventh or eighth , and the girl with the African descent at the sixth . It is hard medically also that the first menstrual cycle known as the ( Alminark menarche) located between the age of ninth and fifteenth . "
 
- That the marriage of a man of the little girl is not a new invention in that era , and in the ages following him , especially in a country that is based on the tribal system , not least because of marriage
 
This is shown clearly in the words of Imam Zuhri : "If the collection of science Aisha to the attention of all the mothers of the believers , and learned all the women were aware of Aisha better ," says Ata ibn Abi Rabah : " Aisha was knowledgeable people , and I know people, the best people say in public ."
 
- Is most surprising is the refusal of Christians to the marriage of the Prophet - peace be upon him - and she was 9 years old , more than fifty , while do not see nothing wrong that was the Virgin Mary betrothed to Joseph , the daughter of a 12 -year-old , which is more than ninety , that is The difference between them was more than seventy-eight years , as reported by the Catholic Encyclopedia .
 
Nor is there in their book " The Holy " is one deny the marriage of girls at the age of nine , or even a single sentence specifying the age of marriage .
 
Did you have to marry the son of Ahaz 10 years , and fathered a son 11 years old , it is stated in 2 Kings 2:16 : « Ahaz was twenty years old when he became king , and he reigned 16 years in Jerusalem . Word in 2 Kings 2:18 : « In the third year of Hoshea son of Elah king of Israel , King Hezekiah the son of Ahaz king of Judah . Son was 25 years old when he became king , and he reigned 29 years in Jerusalem » . Ahaz age shall be 36 years . If the king and his son, aged about 25 years old whose father had Rizk by the age of about 11 years .
 
He said Kshm Manis Abdel Nour in his suspicions about the Bible : " I do not mind to be between him and his father 11 years " , and taking hits historical examples , it is known that the age of maturation of females at least the age of maturation of male in the same region , it means that his wife may have been in the ninth or tenth like him, and even to give birth was valid at that age, so why deny marriage to Aisha at such an age, and your book is not denied .
 
How deny marriage on the beloved prophet in the time that they believe in it that the prophets have committed sins and immorality of incest  weight Lot - peace be upon him - his daughters , and the weight of David 's wife soldier with his army , but ordering the army commander him if the war to kill the enemy , and have no qualms in be described by Solomon - peace be upon him - disbelief , and he worshiped idols ; to in order to satisfy his wives gentile .
 

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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by boatlady on Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:02 pm

Cultural norms may differ - among this group, I think there is general consensus that sexual congress with children (defined as individuals under 16 years) by adults is taboo.
Discussion of such is likely to cause extreme offence.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by oftenwrong on Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:15 pm


"Discussion of such is likely to cause extreme offence."

Which explains the reluctance of British Police to engage with apparently criminal activity within the muslim community.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by toty5 on Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:18 am

Express your love


Prophet Muhammad never held back his love for the children and always expressed his fondness to them. He would pick up children in his arms, play with them, and kiss them.

He played with them and took such keen interest in them. Narrated Abu Hurairah (may Allah be pleased with him),

Allah’s Messenger kissed Al-Hasan ibn `Ali while Al-Aqra` ibn Habis At-Tamim was sitting with him . Al-Aqra` said, “I have ten children and have never kissed one of them.” The Prophet cast a look at him and said, “Whoever is not merciful to others will not be treated mercifully.” (Al-Bukhari)

In one hadith Abu Hurairah (may Allah be pleased with him) narrated:

I went along with Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) at a time during the day but he did not talk to me and I did not talk to him until he reached the market of Banu Qainuqa`. He came back to the tent of Fatimah and said, “Is the little chap (meaning Al-Hasan) there?” We were under the impression that his mother had detained him in order to bathe him and dress him and garland him with sweet garland. Not much time had passed that he (Al-Hasan) came running until both of them embraced each other, thereupon Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him) said, “O Allah, I love him; love him and love one who loves him.” (Muslim)

Anas ibn Malik (may Allah be pleased with him), the servant of the Prophet, had another recollection:

I never saw anyone who was more compassionate towards children than Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings be upon him). His son Ibrahim was in the care of a wet nurse in the hills around Madinah. He would go there, and we would go with him, and he would enter the house, pick up his son and kiss him, then come back. (Muslim)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnQKL8Rsv6s

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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by polyglide on Sat Apr 05, 2014 11:05 am

Anyone who does not initially love their children are not human.

Love can be still present even when children do the most unacceptable.

It is only in humans where you find so much diverse behaviour towards their offspring.

There are several examples of parents killing their children for no apparent reason in the last few weeks.

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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by Ivan on Sat Apr 05, 2014 8:16 pm

boatlady wrote:-
Cultural norms may differ - among this group, I think there is general consensus that sexual congress with children (defined as individuals under 16 years) by adults is taboo. Discussion of such is likely to cause extreme offence.
Firstly, let me put my cards on the table. Anyone who knows me is aware that I am an atheist. I agree with the American philosopher and neuroscientist Sam Harris when he wrote in his ‘Letter To A Christian Nation’:  “You know exactly what it is like to be an atheist with respect to the beliefs of Muslims. Isn’t it obvious that Muslims are fooling themselves? Isn’t it obvious that anyone who thinks that the Qu’ran is the perfect word of the creator of the universe has not read the book critically? Isn’t it obvious that the doctrine of Islam represents a near-perfect barrier to honest inquiry? Yes, these things are obvious. Understand that the way you view Islam is precisely the way devout Muslims view Christianity. And it is the way I view all religions.”
 
Nearly every time that Labour politician Diane Abbott writes an article or makes a statement about anything, up will pop a Tory scrote to remind us that she sent her son (apparently at his request, but they don’t mention that) to a private school in 2003. That is meant to invalidate anything she says or does for evermore. In the same way, anyone intent on rubbishing Islam will probably dive straight in on the Muslim paedophile gangs (such as in Rochdale) who groomed young girls for sex, conveniently overlooking the fact that most paedophiles in the UK are non-Muslims and white. The detractors may also focus on the marriage of 54-year-old Muhammad to 9-year-old Aisha (peace be upon her).
 
If you study history, you must try not to judge the past according to our values in the 21st century. A legal age of consent to sexual intercourse did not exist anywhere in the world before the 13th century. So when Muhammad was living with Aisha in 7th century Arabia, there weren’t laws against such behaviour there or anywhere else. Even so, it will make any decent person feel sick to read evidence here which suggests that this so-called ‘prophet’ did have sex with his 9-year-old wife:-
 
http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Aisha_Age_of_Consummation
 
Of course a Muslim may well come back and say that Mary was probably only 12 when she was betrothed to Joseph, and that Jesus was born about a year later. The Christian response is that Jesus, being the son of God, was the result of ‘a virgin birth’. Yeah, right, believe that one if you like. As I’ve said, I’m an atheist and I take all such yarns with a pinch of salt.
 
An age of consent statute first appeared in secular law in England in 1275 as part of the rape law. The statute, Westminster 1, made it a misdemeanor to "ravish" a "maiden within age”, whether with or without her consent. The phrase "within age" was interpreted by jurist Sir Edward Coke as meaning the age of marriage, which at the time was 12 years of age. A 1576 law making it a felony to "unlawfully and carnally know and abuse any woman child under the age of 10 years" was generally interpreted as creating more severe punishments when girls were under 10 years old.
 
A small group of Italian and German states that introduced an age of consent in the 16th century opted for 12 years. In 1791, the Napoleonic Code in France said that consensual sex was legal at 11 years. In 1875, the age of consent in the UK was raised from 12 to 13. Surprisingly, the age of consent in Spain today is only 13, while in Austria, Germany, Italy and Portugal it’s only 14. But what makes the idea of this 54-year-old 'prophet' having sex with a 9-year-old completely unacceptable, even to those of us with a sense of history, is that:-
 
1. Muhammad seems to have been extremely ‘worldly’ for someone who is seen by so many as a ‘spiritual’ person. At least in the Christian fables, there is no suggestion that Christ engaged in sexual relationships, although I sometimes wonder about that Mary Magdalene character…..
 
2. Whether or not Aisha - and Mary - gave their consent to marriage, they were children who couldn’t possibly understand its implications.
 
3. According to Western 21st century values, anyone who has sex with, or contemplates having sex with, a 9-year-old (or a 12-year-old for that matter) is labelled a paedophile and locked up for a long period of time. And rightly so.
 
No doubt I’ve offended Muslims and Christians alike in this post, but that’s too bad. We don’t persecute people for so-called ‘heresy’ or ‘apostasy’ in Europe these days and, within reason, we do allow free speech – and I’ve just exercised my right to do so. I have no respect whatsoever for any religion, although I do respect the right of people who wish to believe in fairy stories to do so. As long as they don’t use what a so-called ‘prophet’ did or didn’t do in the 7th century as an excuse for having sex with underage children in the 21st century. Historians understand that you can’t judge the past by current values, but nobody should try to tell us to behave in the present in accordance with the myths and legends of the distant past.
 
http://chnm.gmu.edu/cyh/teaching-modules/230
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by boatlady on Sun Apr 06, 2014 10:13 am

Well researched Ivan - and I can get right behind you on the issue of underage sex and marriage.

I will personally take extreme offence at anyone on here posting anything that discusses underage sex and marriage as even remotely a positive thing - as I tried to point out more gently in my previous post.

Sexual behaviour from an adult towards a child does immense harm and is a bad thing. As far as I am concerned there is no room for negotiation on this point.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by oftenwrong on Sun Apr 06, 2014 12:48 pm

There is no worldwide agreement on "the age of consent", so the normal customs of one country might lead to a criminal conviction in another.
 
Where legal definitions differ from either popular opinion or religious teaching, a fertile field is created for the usual racist suspects to foment hatred.

http://chartsbin.com/view/hxj
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by boatlady on Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:37 pm

You're right that there are various local consensus views on this topic.

The dominant social norm in GB - which I feel is about right, taking into account my experiences and knowledge - is that the age of consent for a young person should be at some point following puberty and towards the time said young person becomes independently economically active (fyi this is about 16)

If young people are not legally adult in some sense when they commence a sexual relationship, the power balance within the relationship is distorted and it usually  becomes coercive and in some sense brutalising. No child having sex with an adult is ever really in a position to refuse, to opt out, to object in a real sense to whatever the adult partner wants. No child in a sexual relationship with an adult can walk away as even the most abused adult can.

For these reasons, sexual contact between children and adults is in my view harmful to the child. Children are by their nature dependent upon adults - they deserve that adults show respect for their weakness and wait until they are truly in a position to choose before using them sexually.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by Dan Fante on Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:37 am

toty5 wrote:
.....
Thanks for clearing that up.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by polyglide on Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:51 am

For once I agree totally with boatlady, anyone wanting to subject a child to any kind of sexual behaviour should, in my opinion, be !!!!!!!.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by toty5 on Tue Apr 08, 2014 6:50 pm

Western society doesn't win at all. I'm not sure why so many people make an issue about DESERT TRIBAL PRACTICES in the 6th century. Muhammad did nothing out of the norm for his society. The fact that Aisha went on to become one of the most important Muslims to ever live just makes this criticism empty of any real substance.

"Child marriages such as this were relatively common in Bedouin societies at the time, and remain common in some societies even today.[15] British scholar Colin Turner suggests that such marriages were not seen as improper in historical context, and that individuals in such societies matured at an earlier age than in the modern West."

"British historian William Montgomery Watt suggests that Muhammad hoped to strengthen his ties with Abu Bakr;[6] the strengthening of ties commonly served as a basis for marriage in Arabian culture."

Muhammad was offered the most beautiful Arabian women by the Meccans and Quraysh tribal leaders in return for him abandoning his prophetic message. He turned them down every time. Criticism of Aisha age during her marriage was a non-issue to his followers nor his enemies. People have very recently begun fabricating an issue about it because they struggle to find serious criticism of Muhammad.

European Judaism - "Child marriage was possible in Judaism due to the very low marriageable age for females. A ketannah (literally meaning little [one]) was any girl between the age of 3 years and that of 12 years plus one day;[4] a ketannah was completely subject to her father's authority, and her father could arrange a marriage for her without her agreement."

Not to mention you can go to Guatemala/Honduras/other South American cultures to

find child marriages to be the norm.


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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by toty5 on Tue Apr 08, 2014 6:55 pm

Give them importance

The above Ahadith also show how our Prophet used to give importance to children. This makes children realize their worth.
Prophet  صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم also used to pay attention to children and their interests/hobbies so that they feel important

Anas bin Malik [ra] narrated: The Prophet used to mingle with us to the extent that he would say to the younger brother of mine, “O father of Umair! What did An Nughair [your sparrow] do?” [Muslim]

Strengthen their relationship with Allah

On the authority of Abdullah bin Abbas, we said: One day I was behind the Prophet and he said to me:

“Young man, I shall teach you some words [of advice]: Be mindful of Allah, and Allah will protect you. Be mindful of Allah, and you will find Him in front of you. If you ask, ask of Allah; if you seek help, seek help of Allah. Know that if that Nation were to gather together to benefit you with anything, it would benefit you only with something that Allah had already prescribed for you, and that if they gather together to harm you with anything, they would harm you only with something Allah had already prescribed for you. The pens have been lifted and the pages have dried”

Love all children above cast, creed or color

The Prophet’s love for children was not restricted to his children and grandchildren. The scope of his mercy and affection embraced all children, and he showed the same interest and gentleness to other children. Usamah ibn Zaid (may Allah be pleased with him) narrates:

Allah’s Messenger used to put me on (one of) his thighs and put Al-Hasan ibn `Ali on his other thigh, and then embrace us and say, “O Allah! Please be merciful to them, as I am merciful to them.” (Bukhari)

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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by Ivan on Wed Apr 09, 2014 12:23 am

toty5 wrote:-
Muhammad was offered the most beautiful Arabian women by the Meccans and Quraysh tribal leaders in return for him abandoning his prophetic message. He turned them down every time.

As he had 13 wives altogether, 9 of whom survived him, that was hardly a sacrifice on his part.
 
Criticism of Aisha age during her marriage was a non-issue to his followers nor his enemies. People have very recently begun fabricating an issue about it because they struggle to find serious criticism of Muhammad.
No “fabrication”. Aisha used to play with dolls, and only pre-pubescent girls were allowed to do so in that society. Apologists will often claim that Aisha had reached puberty by the time Muhammad married and had sexual intercourse with her. However, they never provide verifiable proof for this assertion. Instead, they rely on the pre-Islamic culture and traditional practices of 7th century Arabia as evidence of their claim.
 
http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Aisha_Age_of_Consummation
 
My mother came to me while I was being swung on a swing between two branches and got me down. My nurse took over and wiped my face with some water and started leading me. When I was at the door she stopped so I could catch my breath. I was brought in while Muhammad was sitting on a bed in our house. My mother made me sit on his lap. The other men and women got up and left. The Prophet consummated his marriage with me in my house when I was nine years old.”      (Al-Tabari, Vol. 9, p. 131)
 
We know in what way Muhammad ‘loved’ children, he had sex with at least one of them, and attempts to justify that are offensive. I’d say the same if a fundamentalist Christian started a thread and tried to convince us that it was okay for Jephthah to barbecue his daughter (according to Judges 11), on the basis that that was the sort of thing which occurred in tribal society.
 
boatlady wrote:-
Sexual behaviour from an adult towards a child does immense harm and is a bad thing. As far as I am concerned there is no room for negotiation on this point.
Agreed. This thread is now locked, and any attempt to justify sex with children anywhere else on this forum will be deleted and may result in a ban for the poster concerned.
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Re: The best ways to deal with ........

Post by Shirina on Wed Apr 09, 2014 4:12 pm

boatlady wrote:You're right that there are various local consensus views on this topic.

The dominant social norm in GB - which I feel is about right, taking into account my experiences and knowledge - is that the age of consent for a young person should be at some point following puberty and towards the time said young person becomes independently economically active (fyi this is about 16)

If young people are not legally adult in some sense when they commence a sexual relationship, the power balance within the relationship is distorted and it usually  becomes coercive and in some sense brutalising. No child having sex with an adult is ever really in a position to refuse, to opt out, to object in a real sense to whatever the adult partner wants. No child in a sexual relationship with an adult can walk away as even the most abused adult can.

For these reasons, sexual contact between children and adults is in my view harmful to the child. Children are by their nature dependent upon adults - they deserve that adults show respect for their weakness and wait until they are truly in a position to choose before using them sexually.

Very, very well said.
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