I am officially renouncing my US citizenship

First topic message reminder :

I've been thinking long and hard about this decision, and it is not one that I have come to lightly. I won't burden everyone with a huge post about why since this is a personal decision, but I can no longer live in this country. I have come to the painful conclusion that the liberal mindset is losing the political war ... and losing to the point of imminent defeat. What I see is hatred, bigotry, and fascism overriding all good sense. America is an ignorant, benighted nation with narrow-minded, selfish goals for itself, a nation that resists and refuses to take its place in a larger community. We are in a state of serious decline, one that I no longer believe will recover. Canada, in fact, has just usurped America for per capita income, which shows that we are, in fact, in a free fall.

But worse still is that the population, the masses, have succumbed to lies and propaganda to such an extent that the Republicans no longer even try to hide their lies. They have realized that far too many people will believe whatever they say, irrespective of facts, and the small numbers of people like myself - who try desperately to get them to see reality - are making no progress. Instead, we are beaten down and drowned out with insults, bans, blocks, and being put on ignore. It seems everywhere I go, everyone I talk to, they believe in conservatism, the gospel of profit and money, and only refer to the Bible when they have someone to persecute, judge, oppress, or strip freedoms from.

I do not think Obama will win in November. And while I do not believe that Obama is some sort of savior, the reality is that he's the best we have right now. Nor do I stand against a Republican holding office. However, the conservatives have gone so far to the right now that a Republican victory this year will be the beginning of the end. I am embarrassed to be an American, embarrassed to call the majority of these benighted, ignorant, small-minded people my countrymen. The individual shining lights we have are too few, too powerless, too ignored for there to be any change. Instead, we as a nation will spiral into the "ash heap of history," to borrow Reagan's term, a nation once great but is no longer.

The American Century is over. I do not believe that the current electorate has the will, the intelligence, the vision, or the capacity to achieve anything truly great ... not in my lifetime. Today, I feel like a Jew fleeing the coming fascism of Nazi Germany. Many felt it, many knew intuitively the horrors that lay ahead ... and I feel that now living in America. As a liberal, I have no place here. During the McCarthy era, people were jailed for merely having left-wing views, and I fear we will eventually return to such a time, and perhaps as we relive history we should have learned from, the second time around will be far worse.

I have argued and debated as best I could, but now I am not even allowed to be heard. Only here, on a British board, can I express my views without insult, without bans, without being put on an ignore list. You all know me well enough now to know I do not name-call nor do I post things without facts to back them up. Yet for doing that, I am essentially a pariah in my own lands. If the Americans wish to chant their patriotic slogans as they sink into the abyss, let them ... but I will not go so quietly into the night.

To that effect, I have contacted the US embassy, the British embassy, and the Indian embassy in DC to begin the process of emigration away from a country I consider to be doomed. I may end up in the UK, so who knows ... I may get to participate more on UK discussion threads! But I cannot stay here unless Obama wins, and if he does, I will still have time to reconsider my decision. But alas, I am not too hopeful. The vehement hatred of liberals runs so deep now it has become a part of American culture. I find the constant struggle against insurmountable odds and numbers to be a thoroughly pointless endeavor, one that myself, and those like me, cannot possibly hope to win.

Should I move, I will inform Ivan and the rest should I need an extended absence from the board. Moving overseas is not a small undertaking. At any rate, that's that, but I thought I would let my friends here know, and perhaps understand, the gravity of the situation.

Best wishes.

You better not.

Shirina wrote:

I am officially renouncing my US citizenship

Is that really a good idea?

Guru footy coach; "Never burn bridges and slam doors, you might want to go back".

Britain today is not utopia either.

What if...you renounce your US citizenship, move to another country, and it doesn't work out?

In July, I wrote on this thread, "A personal decision is quite simply that, personal. It is not appropriate for anyone else to make anything other than general comment."

I am glad for my country that you are staying. Would you submit to cloning?

So you decided to stay after Obama won?

skwalker1964 wrote:So you decided to stay after Obama won?

Honestly, I still don't know if I'm staying in the US. The gun issue raging here right now is giving me second thoughts about staying. I may be forced into an individualized domestic arms race if I stay here since the gun nuts are starting to classify everyone as either predator or prey. Gun owners and non-owners. Plus the conspiracy loons are out in force, and they are being given air time on CNN and other major networks so they can spout their crap to a wider audience. Look up Piers Morgan's interview with Alex Jones about gun control if you want to see what I'm talking about. Now the gun asshats are threatening Obama with impeachment if he signs any executive orders limiting or banning the sale of assault weapons and county sheriffs around the country are claiming they will refuse to enforce any gun control laws coming out of Washington. Of course, all of this talk of owning guns is mostly about the need to overthrow the government - in case we ever wanted to do that.

I've also seen how the National Rifle Association (NRA) has members in congress that have deliberately blocked any and all attempts at enforcing existing guns laws by adding amendments to bills that have severely restricted the ability for law enforcement to monitor, track, inspect, and investigate gun sales.

This is a nation of fanatics, where rational behavior is considered treasonous. The right-wingers talk ceaselessly about family values, yet the "right" to own assault rifles and 100 round magazines is far more important than the lives of their children. Better to have 6 year-olds shot up by the dozen than to give even an inch on gun ownership policies.

Every time I turn around, I am being given a reminder of why this nation possesses a provincial, intolerant, paranoid, fearful, xenophobic, superstitious culture shackled by geographic isolation and a highly effective right-wing propaganda machine. I really no longer feel at home among them.

The UK's no picnic at the moment, but it doesn't have those problems at least. Come here - we need more lefties. Ideally, move to a marginal seat!

"Those problems" seem to migrate with ever greater ease across the Atlantic. It's blindingly obvious that the Coalition has received considerable input ever since its formation, from Republican policy wonks. My impression is that extreme Right-wingers from the USA are using their Country Cousins in the Tory Party to try out some radical ideas - as an experiment. They think of the British Electorate (if we are considered at all) as white mice.

oftenwrong wrote:"Those problems" seem to migrate with ever greater ease across the Atlantic. It's blindingly obvious that the Coalition has received considerable input ever since its formation, from Republican policy wonks. My impression is that extreme Right-wingers from the USA are using their Country Cousins in the Tory Party to try out some radical ideas - as an experiment. They think of the British Electorate (if we are considered at all) as white mice.

I believe you're right on the first part, less sure about the white mice bit - I think the 'country cousins' have been avid consumers of US ideas and methods, so while we may be the white mice, the Americans may not be the instigators.

OW, where do you get the idea that any party here takes a blind bit of notice of what the republicans say. Didn't they throw a sulky because Cameron wouldn't meet them as he only deals with the current government rather than "wannabes". Take note Labour.

tlttf wrote:OW, where do you get the idea that any party here takes a blind bit of notice of what the republicans say. Didn't they throw a sulky because Cameron wouldn't meet them as he only deals with the current government rather than "wannabes". Take note Labour.

If you didn't read the Sunday Times (PM's aide exposes impotent No. 10) this week, you may be interested to google the name Steve Hilton, the originator of many ideas which Cameron could never have thought up on his own.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/8667058/David-Camerons-senior-adviser-Steve-Hilton-suggests-UK-should-abolish-maternity-leave.html

Aren't aide's meant to make suggestions no matter how outlandish OW. Didn't you used to be a business man. Does it mean he has to act on them. Reality is all 3 of the wannabe parties are offering pretty much the same shyte, they're simply dressing it differently.

The difference being, I think, that the Labour Party are not frightened to regard the under-privileged or less able as humans.

Shirina wrote:

Canadian Forces CF/A-18 Hornets

They really need to upgrade these to Super Hornets. Right now, they're only flying F/A-18As (not even the C model).

Maybe they have no choice...Washington is not big on selling anyone the top of the line models.

Australia is not allowed to buy the ones with all the bells and whistles, but only the 'base' models.

Maybe they have no choice...Washington is not big on selling anyone the top of the line models.

I'm fairly certain that the Kuwaitis have the F-16C-40 variant which is very close to top of the line - certainly better than the F-16A models. I suppose Canada doesn't really have a pressing need.

I would become a “stateless” person with nowhere on Earth to go.

The United Nations High Commission for Refugees, UNHCR, is able to issue a Passport to genuinely "stateless" people.

I'm not sure whether possession of such a document would stop the IRS from pursuing a sometime citizen of the USA for unpaid taxes, however.

Hi Shirina!!!
I am really missing you at trivia!!! I hope you will join us again soon!!

Hugs,
Icey

Hello, Icey,

I might pop in tonight but I can't be sure. Lots of things going on in life right now, none of them all that good. I haven't forgotten you, though!

Take care.

Okay honey I am looking forward to seeing you again soon. Sending you good thoughts and hugs and I hope things get better for you!!!

Hi Shirina,
I haven't seen you around anywhere for a while. I do hope you are okay.
I sure do miss you!!!  

Shirina wrote:I've been thinking long and hard about this decision, and it is not one that I have come to lightly. I won't burden everyone with a huge post about why since this is a personal decision, but I can no longer live in this country. I have come to the painful conclusion that the liberal mindset is losing the political war ... and losing to the point of imminent defeat. What I see is hatred, bigotry, and fascism overriding all good sense. America is an ignorant, benighted nation with narrow-minded, selfish goals for itself, a nation that resists and refuses to take its place in a larger community. We are in a state of serious decline, one that I no longer believe will recover. Canada, in fact, has just usurped America for per capita income, which shows that we are, in fact, in a free fall.

But worse still is that the population, the masses, have succumbed to lies and propaganda to such an extent that the Republicans no longer even try to hide their lies. They have realized that far too many people will believe whatever they say, irrespective of facts, and the small numbers of people like myself - who try desperately to get them to see reality - are making no progress. Instead, we are beaten down and drowned out with insults, bans, blocks, and being put on ignore. It seems everywhere I go, everyone I talk to, they believe in conservatism, the gospel of profit and money, and only refer to the Bible when they have someone to persecute, judge, oppress, or strip freedoms from.

I do not think Obama will win in November. And while I do not believe that Obama is some sort of savior, the reality is that he's the best we have right now. Nor do I stand against a Republican holding office. However, the conservatives have gone so far to the right now that a Republican victory this year will be the beginning of the end. I am embarrassed to be an American, embarrassed to call the majority of these benighted, ignorant, small-minded people my countrymen. The individual shining lights we have are too few, too powerless, too ignored for there to be any change. Instead, we as a nation will spiral into the "ash heap of history," to borrow Reagan's term, a nation once great but is no longer.

The American Century is over. I do not believe that the current electorate has the will, the intelligence, the vision, or the capacity to achieve anything truly great ... not in my lifetime. Today, I feel like a Jew fleeing the coming fascism of Nazi Germany. Many felt it, many knew intuitively the horrors that lay ahead ... and I feel that now living in America. As a liberal, I have no place here. During the McCarthy era, people were jailed for merely having left-wing views, and I fear we will eventually return to such a time, and perhaps as we relive history we should have learned from, the second time around will be far worse.

I have argued and debated as best I could, but now I am not even allowed to be heard. Only here, on a British board, can I express my views without insult, without bans, without being put on an ignore list. You all know me well enough now to know I do not name-call nor do I post things without facts to back them up. Yet for doing that, I am essentially a pariah in my own lands. If the Americans wish to chant their patriotic slogans as they sink into the abyss, let them ... but I will not go so quietly into the night.

To that effect, I have contacted the US embassy, the British embassy, and the Indian embassy in DC to begin the process of emigration away from a country I consider to be doomed. I may end up in the UK, so who knows ... I may get to participate more on UK discussion threads! But I cannot stay here unless Obama wins, and if he does, I will still have time to reconsider my decision. But alas, I am not too hopeful. The vehement hatred of liberals runs so deep now it has become a part of American culture. I find the constant struggle against insurmountable odds and numbers to be a thoroughly pointless endeavor, one that myself, and those like me, cannot possibly hope to win.

Should I move, I will inform Ivan and the rest should I need an extended absence from the board. Moving overseas is not a small undertaking. At any rate, that's that, but I thought I would let my friends here know, and perhaps understand, the gravity of the situation.

Best wishes.

If you come to the UK, avoid the London temptations and come to Caerdydd/Cardiff - a chroeso/welcome!