Thatcher changed Britain for the worse

First topic message reminder :

Through the Thatcher Major, years, millions of British people were made poor as a matter of policy, while others got rich as a matter of policy.

Blair and Brown embraced Thatcherism due to the change in the British, and now Milliband wants to change Labour again due to a changed Britain.

I personally long for a political party that sticks to it's core values, that has conviction, that does not change itself to suit a greedy selfish uncaring British populas who'se only thought is "self". In my view this "self" is mainly among the British middle classes.

Thatcher changed Britain for the worse, and now we are reaping through this dreadful coalition, what has been sown.

Quote : " Thatcher would've been dragged from a sewer drain and dispatched ..."

I do so love to see the British sense of fair play evidenced -as above. This is to be applauded when a call for boiling in oil whilst being forced to read the Daily Mirror would have been more than amply justified...

Most enjoyable and fairly apt!!

Read up please on The Hermitage, (It's where Mary Queen of Scots went to see Bothwell.) Before her time, the Lord of the Manor was not too pleased that a neighbour would not sell land that said Lord coveted much!!! So the small landowner was laid out in a srcophagus and had boiling lead poured over him!! End of dispute apparently! The death mask is in the museum in Carlisle!



http://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/hawick/hermitagecastle/index.html

http://www.undiscoveredscotland.co.uk/usbiography/s/williamdesoulis.html

Lords, ladies, royals etc were nothing but thieves.........still are.

sickchip wrote:Lords, ladies, royals etc were nothing but thieves.........still are.

They are the hallmark of our obscene class system.

blueturando wrote:Thatcher is a hero, tranforming our country into a leading economic nation instead of the 'Sick man of Europe' that Labour turned us into during the late 70's.
Sickchip and Phil...I wont change your mind and you wont change mine, but winning 3 elections says that the British people agreed with me

You really think this cold run-down casino is a 'leading economic nation' do you? Well, you belong in it, friend!

"friend". ?. The man's an idiot.

Ivanhoe wrote:"friend". ?. The man's an idiot.

I believe, like the old Russians, that if there were a God he would care for them especially!

You are entitled to your opinions Ivanhoe & Penderyn, but don't let our political differences get in the way of our blossoming friendship

Peace & much love Blue x

A career in the Diplomatic Service surely awaits that fellow bluey...

blueturando wrote:You are entitled to your opinions Ivanhoe & Penderyn, but don't let our political differences get in the way of our blossoming friendship

Peace & much love Blue x

So, you believe that Thatcher is a hero, even though she created a massive rich and poor divide in this country ?

Yes, or no ?

Yes I believe she is a hero....she was and is to me and I come from what you would label a poor background

and No I don't believe she created a rich/poor divide...it has always been there, for a least a couple of centuries (Try reading a few Dickens novels)

Wouldn’t it be a nice thing to know, that is that the Bitch Thatcher, either hears of or reads (assuming her eyes still work) the messages of adoration on these boards, It must make waking up every morning (whilst she still can) worth while, especially the bits about her funeral, when she is only partly dead. Never mind Maggie, the rest will follow, and don’t mind you will get more at your funeral than Princess Dianna, as there will be queues so long that the mourners wont be able to hold their urine and unfortunately will have to let go before reaching your Grave.
Just one thing folks, don’t piss on your own boots, as she simply aint worth the effort of having to clean them..

A very provocative statement there bluey. Pray tell what she did that was, as you say "Heroic"

Bobby...I am sensing you have a sexual fascination with dear Maggie. You really should see someone about that

Bobby...there are many thing that impressed me about Maggie (and some that didn't)...I will go into more detail this evening as I am just about the leave the office now

bluetorando wrote.
"Bobby...I am sensing you have a sexual fascination with dear Maggie. You really should see someone about that"

You may be right there Bluey as I would love to see a porn film, showing Maggie getting done by any one of an Elephants 5 sex organs.

blueturando wrote:Yes I believe she is a hero....she was and is to me and I come from what you would label a poor background

and No I don't believe she created a rich/poor divide...it has always been there, for a least a couple of centuries (Try reading a few Dickens novels)

We HAD managed to move beyond Dickens, rather impressively - no beggars, health for all, democracy and so on - before the Thatcherites restored us to the good old filth. No arguing with Faith, alas - but yours is a very muddled, sick sort of notion all the same. Has it struck you that you'd make a better tory Prime Minister than the current flab? But, then, most tories would. Most apes, too.

No I don't believe she created a rich/poor divide...it has always been there

blue. Nice to be able to agree with you for once. There has always been inequality and always will be, from the days when people were Roman slaves or medieval serfs. The pursuit of equality is a mirage.

However, what some of us would like to see is equality of opportunity, a meritocracy, where anyone can fulfil their potential without the help of inherited wealth and accident of birth. And we'd also like a less unequal society, perhaps more on a par with Germany, Sweden or Denmark. My complaint with Thatcher in this regard is that she deliberately set out to make Britain more unequal. I well remember three of her sayings - "what Britain needs is more inequality", "some of us need to grow tallen than others", and of course the notorious "there's no such thing as society".

Thankfully the troughites are out of power, they caused more damage to both our economy and self respect in the last 13 years than any government in our history. The idiots in power now are attempting to put right the damage caused, unfortunately a majority of the population have become used to something for nothing an education had been put on the back foot, weirdly spending more on services did nothing to improve said services. A complete overhaul is now required and the previous fools were too scared to make a decision as it might ruin their future paypackets and pensions.

How lonely it must feel, to be the only marcher who's in step.

The Thatcher State Funeral may witness an outburst of popular sorrow that will rival those for North Korea's Kim Jong-Il.

The ten years of government under the leadership of Tony Blair was the most stable period in Britain since the 1960s, contrary to what any Conservative supporter may state or believe, borrowing was most definately not out of control, infact in 2007 the debt of the country was lower than in 1997 when john Major left office.

During those ten years and prior to the onset of the world-wide credit crunch and subsequent recession, we enjoyed the longest period of sustained growth in history, we also enjoyed vastly improving public services, in particular the NHS with thousands of new doctors and nurses, rapidly falling waiting lists and waiting times.

Very different to the years under Margaret Thatcher and John Major which saw TWO recessions, unemployment out of control, riots, the miners strike which took us close to serious civil unrest, the poll tax riots, one third of British manufacturing destroyed, an NHS totaly crippled by severe lack of funding and record numbers of bankruptcies and home reposessions.

And some people think that life in Britain was better under Margaret Thatcher ?

oftenwrong wrote:The Thatcher State Funeral may witness an outburst of popular sorrow that will rival those for North Korea's Kim Jong-Il.

It will be a chance to create the biggest public urinal in the western world! She was a believer in such great predecessors as the one named in Byron's poem:

'Posterity shall never see
Another grave than this -
These are the bones of Castlereagh -
Pause, traveller, and piss!

blueturando wrote:Yes I believe she is a hero....she was and is to me and I come from what you would label a poor background

and No I don't believe she created a rich/poor divide...it has always been there, for a least a couple of centuries (Try reading a few Dickens novels)

It is a media and Parliamentary fact, and as written in Hansard, that Margaret Thatcher not only left a legacy of extreme poverty, and extreme wealth when she left office, but that also Blair and Brown widened the rich and poor devide by sticking to Thatcher's right wing policies under New Labour.

Again, this is a fact. Not a myth. And yes, Britain has always had rich, and poor people. But Margaret Thatcher created a massive rich and poor divide as a matter of policy. And this is the vital difference.

There is little doubt that, from Thatcher onwards, successive governments have sought to actively encourage greater levels of inequality, and discourage social mobility. Maybe the establishment were beginning to think the 'baby boomers' were beginning to overstep the mark after the 60's and 70's.......the decades when working class people were truly given scope to improve their lot.

The lack of investment in manufacturing/industry (an area where working classes could prosper), and the deregulation of banks allowing investors/shareholders/mps/et al (the wealthy) to reap further undeserved rewards is only one example of this. This over dependence on the financial sector is proving to be a destructive folly of the greedy classes who rule the UK......and so they continue to defend the national casinos as they ruin society, families, people's livelihoods, and young people's prospects.

Many here, who have read my views on these sites over the years, will be aware that one of the continuous threads running through my arguments is the need to reduce the disgusting wage differentials in this country. I hope it is beginning to dawn on some why I have been so vehement in that argument.

sickchip wrote:There is little doubt that, from Thatcher onwards, successive governments have sought to actively encourage greater levels of inequality, and discourage social mobility. Maybe the establishment were beginning to think the 'baby boomers' were beginning to overstep the mark after the 60's and 70's.......the decades when working class people were truly given scope to improve their lot.

The lack of investment in manufacturing/industry (an area where working classes could prosper), and the deregulation of banks allowing investors/shareholders/mps/et al (the wealthy) to reap further undeserved rewards is only one example of this. This over dependence on the financial sector is proving to be a destructive folly of the greedy classes who rule the UK......and so they continue to defend the national casinos as they ruin society, families, people's livelihoods, and young people's prospects.

Many here, who have read my views on these sites over the years, will be aware that one of the continuous threads running through my arguments is the need to reduce the disgusting wage differentials in this country. I hope it is beginning to dawn on some why I have been so vehement in that argument.

Brilliantly observed.

This gem, written by Salman Rushdie, was published in 'The Guardian' on 23 May 1983, shortly before the general election:-

"Consider this fiction. A Tory Prime Minister, Maggie May, gets elected on the basis of her promises to cut direct taxation and to get the country back to work (“Labour isn’t working”). During the next four years, she increases direct taxation and contrives to add almost two million people to the dole queues. And she throws in all sorts of extra goodies; a fifth of the country’s manufacturing industry lies in ruins. And (although she claims repeatedly to have vanquished the monster inflation) she presides over the largest increase in prices of any British Prime Minister. The country’s housing programme grinds to a halt; schools and hospitals are closed; the Nationality Act robs Britons of their 900-year-old right to citizenship by virtue of birth; and the great windfall of North Sea oil money is squandered on financing unemployment. Money is poured into the police force, and as a result notifiable crimes rise by 28%.

She constantly tells the nation that cash limits are tight, but finds untold billions to spend on a crazy war whose legacy includes the export of drinking water to the South Atlantic at a cost to the British taxpayer of 5p a pint; and speaking of peace, she earmarks further untold billions for the purchase of the latest weapons of death, although common sense, not to mention history, clearly indicates that the more such weapons exist, the more likely they are to be used.

So far, the story of Prime Minister May is almost credible. The fictional character does come across as unusually cruel, incompetent, unscrupulous and violent, but there have just occasionally been Tory politicians of whom such a description would not be wholly inaccurate. No, the story only falls apart when it gets to the end: Maggie May decides to go to the country, and instead of being hounded into the outer darkness, or at least Tasmania, like her whoring namesake, it seems that she is to receive a vote of confidence; that five more years of cruelty, incompetence, etc, is what the electorate wants."

Dictionary definition, HERO

someone who has done something brave, for example saving a person’s life or risking their own life

or in one particular case, someone who risked other people's lives, apparently.

http://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/american/hero

Some opinions which give plenty of reasons why Thatcher has been far too controversial to receive a state funeral:-

Robert Anderson:-
As a miner who was vilified by Thatcher as the “enemy within” for taking a principled stand against the destruction of a vital energy resource, I will never forgive her or her cronies in essence branding me a traitor, when in reality, she is the most treasonous person to have inhabited these shores since Lord Haw-Haw. I did not “sell the family silver”, deprive 3 million people of work, or send soldiers to their deaths when the Falklands war could and should have been avoided. I didn’t smash long standing stable communities or involve myself in redistributing wealth to the very rich, nor did I give the rain that falls on our heads to profiteering privateers. I did not support vile dictators like Pinochet or the Saudis and I certainly did not support the evil white apartheid government of South Africa or deem one of the greatest living human beings, Nelson Mandela, a “terrorist”. I love my country very much and therefore I will not be mourning this traitor who well and truly sold out to big business.

Dave Osler:-
My generation witnessed first hand Thatcher’s destruction of Britain’s industrial base, her deliberately planned decimation of entire communities and her erection of greed as the very basis of the value system in a country for which there was no such thing as society. The very idea of according this woman a state funeral is surely entirely inappropriate for the most divisive figure in post-war British politics. You mourn if you want to; this lad’s not for mourning.

http://liberalconspiracy.org/2011/12/23/thatchers-funeral-you-mourn-if-you-want-to/

I could not agree. Brilliant posting. I hope that the true bluey on this site is reading these and so many other anti Thatcher posts.

How anybody in their right mind can defend this bitch, I have no idea.

The thing is, has he or she got the guts to come on here and spout their pro-Thatcher venim ?

Maybe we could drum up some support for modernising our November custom of burning Guy Fawkes in favour of someone more contemporary?

Quote : "Maybe we could drum up some support for modernising our November custom of burning Guy Fawkes in favour of someone more contemporary?"


(guardian.co.uk)

Choose from the above options....

One of Thatcher's favourite sayings was: "The trouble with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money".

She didn't go on to say that the beauty of capitalism is you never run out of other people's money to spend, and if through your own greed and incompetence things do go belly up, you can always claim your bank or business is 'too big to fail' and blackmail the government into giving you enormous handouts at the public expense.

Ivan wrote:One of Thatcher's favourite sayings was: "The trouble with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money".

She didn't go on to say that the beauty of capitalism is you never run out of other people's money to spend, and if through your own greed and incompetence things do go belly up, you can always claim your bank or business is 'too big to fail' and blackmail the government into giving you enormous handouts at the public expense.

Well put. Thatcher's ideoligy was totally against the human soul, but people cstill put her, and her evil ideiligy into power.

Thatcher supporters are small minded, thick, greedy, and self centred.

Thatcher created a giant chasm in society when she dropped the higher rate of income tax from 83% to 40%.......obviously she liked the rich and sought to make them much much much much richer than the peasants. Maybe dropping it to 60% would have been more reasonable. This was in part funded by Thatcher increasing VAT from 8% to 17.5% so we all had to compensate the revenue for Thatchers desire to keep the toffs in super luxurious lifestyles.

Mind you New Labour (and Tory Blair) never done anything to reverse this disgusting bias towards the already wealthy.

It seems they are talking about giving her a State Funeral (waiting, presumably, until she dies). My immediate reaction is the leavings should just be thrown on the nearest dunghill, but then, as a civilized person, I admit she should be properly buried - at a crossroads with a stake through her heart - if any stake can be found hard enough to penetrate the thing.

sick chip. One of the biggest cons to the working man was the percentage pay rise. Prior to that, most people would get a £sd pay rise and so would management. But with the percentage pay rise, if everyone gets 5%, the lesser earners get 5% of a pittance whereas those on higher wages got 5% of the higher sum. 5% of £100 is £5 5% of £200 is £10, not only that but the increase is compound so the difference becomes bigger year on year.

Thatcher created a giant chasm in society when she dropped the higher rate of income tax from 83% to 40%.

There you've said it all really Sickchip...No wonder the country suffered a brain drain. 83% is just plain greedy!!!

Iffin the Tory Party so desperately want to see M.T. have a state funeral, then I feel that the Tory party and it's supporters should pick up the tab, NOT the Tax Payer. (By their own admission, most in the tory hierarchy and tory paymasters do not pay taxes in this country, it should NOT be us who pick up the bill)

Hello V, I would hapily pay a share of the costs, but only iffin I could watch the bitch taking her final breath.