Why are British youth so politically apathetic compared to European youth?

by Ivanhoe Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:20 pm

Hi, I just wrote the below heading into my server, and the following came up on a debating site. I would be interested in knowing what people had to say.

“”Why are British youth so politically apathetic compared to European youth?”

I find British youth incredibly apathetic about politics compared to youth in many European countries. Many British people under 25 would struggle to recall the names of the two politicians who make up the coalition government, let alone go into any sustained debate about policy.

On the other hand, European youth, most prominently in countries such as France, Italy and Greece seem to be very politically involved, to both the right and left of the spectrum. It seems in many European countries politics is commonly discussed and debated amongst youth and as a result they often hold stronger opinions on policy.

The only theory I have is that in many European countries politics tends to be far more polarised and radical than in Britain. In the UK, both the far right and far left are fairly weak, while in France and Italy, both the far right and far left are pretty sizable political forces.

Also, I do sometimes wonder if British people are discouraged from holding strong opinions, and being perceived as a radical in the UK makes you be perceived as a weirdo. While in Europe, being opinionated is perceived as a positive thing.

by oftenwrong Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:23 pm

Foreigners are so excitable, don't you think?

by **Phil Hornby** Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:01 pm

Apathy? Like - who cares, man...? Shocked

by astra Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:03 pm

Who? what? where?

back to street corner innit! sniff!

by witchfinder Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:36 pm

I would guess that there is more than one reason why younger people are ignited by politics in mainland Europe, but completely turned off by the subject in this country.

One reason is probably cultural, its regarded as been stuffy and geeky, weird and unfashionable to be interested in politics in this country, instead you should be in the night club, wine bar, on a night out.

Another reason is probably that politics by its very nature is more exciting on mainland Europe, partly due to the political system where minority parties are more prominent due to the electoral system, and where the extremes of politics create more contoversy, as in France with the National Front.

But I think most of all the British system is in need of serious modernisation to bring politics into the 21st century.

by Ivanhoe Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:27 am

witchfinder wrote:I would guess that there is more than one reason why younger people are ignited by politics in mainland Europe, but completely turned off by the subject in this country.

One reason is probably cultural, its regarded as been stuffy and geeky, weird and unfashionable to be interested in politics in this country, instead you should be in the night club, wine bar, on a night out.

Another reason is probably that politics by its very nature is more exciting on mainland Europe, partly due to the political system where minority parties are more prominent due to the electoral system, and where the extremes of politics create more contoversy, as in France with the National Front.

But I think most of all the British system is in need of serious modernisation to bring politics into the 21st century.

I year ago I lost a good friend to cancer. He ran a language school, and travelled America and Europe widely. He stated to me many time that Europe's state education system are properly funded and that young people across Europe have a vastly more intelligent's level than the average British adult.

He also told me that EU workers pay more income tax than we do, and that the EU State plays a vital role in investment and subsidy when it come to manufacturing and industry.

We both met in 1992, I was a Labour activist and he was a Lib-Dem activist. We both agreed about Thatcherism and the free market being alien to human decency.

He loathed the British largely, because he knew, as i do, that the working class Tory is a fool.

by jackthelad Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:25 am

Why are British youth so politically apathetic to Europeans youth ?.

That one is simple to answer, they don't want to turn out like William Haige, the Tory boy wonder.

by bobby Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:34 am

I think you only need to look at thing like PMQ’s, to see how not to behave, especially people like Herr Cameron. Anyone would think he was still in the halls of Eton by the childish and arrogant way he behaves. If I where a youngster I really don’t think he would be a good advert for what I might want to aspire to,They (esspecially the Tory's and Lib-Dems) lie through their back teeth, then there is all the hear, hearing and the booing and chanting and paper waving, these are people who are responsible for the 4th or 5th richest country on the planet. I must admit I behaved better in my secondary school assembly hall. Politics is now pushed down our throats, you can not scan your TV channels without coming across several channels depicting these Whitehall children (of all persuasions). If you look at the French and Italian parliaments, they all speak with much more passion, they dress better and you may even get a punch up or two.

by jackthelad Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:45 am

If you look at the French and Italian parliaments, they all speak with much more passion, they dress better and you may even get a punch up or two.

Wasn't there a Tory once and not in the distant past, that lost his rag and swung a mace in the House of Parliament, i would think that was a show of passion, wouldn't you. Michael Hessletine was the man in question.

by Ivanhoe Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:53 am

jackthelad wrote:If you look at the French and Italian parliaments, they all speak with much more passion, they dress better and you may even get a punch up or two.

Wasn't there a Tory once and not in the distant past, that lost his rag and swung a mace in the House of Parliament, i would think that was a show of passion, wouldn't you. Michael Hessletine was the man in question.

I know that there are decent politicians in what was once a decent left of centre British Conservative party, and Labour party, but they arent getting a look in because the media are leading from the front and dumbing us down.

by oftenwrong Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:41 pm

QUOTE "I would guess that there is more than one reason why younger people are ignited by politics in mainland Europe, but completely turned off by the subject in this country."

Maybe an early realisation that the Westminster Parliament has little connection with real life.

by bobby Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:46 pm

Re Michael Heseltine's smashing of the Mace, that was simply a tantrum from a spoilt bratt, who was used to getting his own way. You could not find a colder fish than Micheal Heseltine.

by bobby Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:46 pm

spot on ow.

by Redflag Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:12 pm

bobby wrote:I think you only need to look at thing like PMQ’s, to see how not to behave, especially people like Herr Cameron. Anyone would think he was still in the halls of Eton by the childish and arrogant way he behaves. If I where a youngster I really don’t think he would be a good advert for what I might want to aspire to,They (esspecially the Tory's and Lib-Dems) lie through their back teeth, then there is all the hear, hearing and the booing and chanting and paper waving, these are people who are responsible for the 4th or 5th richest country on the planet. I must admit I behaved better in my secondary school assembly hall. Politics is now pushed down our throats, you can not scan your TV channels without coming across several channels depicting these Whitehall children (of all persuasions). If you look at the French and Italian parliaments, they all speak with much more passion, they dress better and you may even get a punch up or two.

Hi bobby I am going to quote Dennis Skinner MP from yesterday " If it had been Atlee coming back from Munich he would have came back WAVING a WHITE Paper".

by jackthelad Wed Feb 01, 2012 2:31 pm

Hi bobby I am going to quote Dennis Skinner MP from yesterday " If it had been Atlee coming back from Munich he would have came back WAVING a WHITE Paper".

I thought it was Nevile Chamberlin that came back waving a white paper, saying, peace in out time. Someone is re-writing history.

by bobby Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:32 pm

The paper was apparently signed by Herr Hitler, not to be confused with Herr Cameron. I know it will be difficult to distinguish between the two, but there you are.

by **Phil Hornby** Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:50 pm

Quote " I know it will be difficult to distinguish between the two, but there you are. "

I think I have it : Hitler had that funny little moustache and was the more considerate of the two chaps in question...

by bobby Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:04 pm

Absolutely correct Phil. and they both had something else in common. They both had a fat man close to them. Herr Hitler had Eric Pickles and Herr Cameron Has Herman Goering. Or somefink like that.

by oftenwrong Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:07 pm

Why not?

by witchfinder Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:53 pm

Ivanhoe

In an above post mentions how he as a Labour activist, and a friend who was a Lib Dem activist both agree that the free market system is "alien to human decency", and to a degree I agree.

But there are some basic principles of capitalism that we cannot escape from, for example "you cannot spend what you dont have" which should also go on to say "or what you cannot pay back".

I also agree that state education and public services are properly funded in most of mainland Europe, they are also valued and do not suffer from discrimination based on political ideology, as they are here.

If we want better schools, better public services and to continue supporting our NHS, then we either raise more funds from somewhere, or we take the money from somewhere else.

France has just agreed to introduce the banking levy, refered to as "the Robin Hood Tax" by many here, something that Cameron has ruled out, but that would be a good starting point.

by Ivanhoe Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:00 pm

witchfinder wrote:Ivanhoe

In an above post mentions how he as a Labour activist, and a friend who was a Lib Dem activist both agree that the free market system is "alien to human decency", and to a degree I agree.

But there are some basic principles of capitalism that we cannot escape from, for example "you cannot spend what you dont have" which should also go on to say "or what you cannot pay back".

I also agree that state education and public services are properly funded in most of mainland Europe, they are also valued and do not suffer from discrimination based on political ideology, as they are here.

If we want better schools, better public services and to continue supporting our NHS, then we either raise more funds from somewhere, or we take the money from somewhere else.

France has just agreed to introduce the banking levy, refered to as "the Robin Hood Tax" by many here, something that Cameron has ruled out, but that would be a good starting point.

Wrong. It is a question of wealth distribution. Britain is a very wealthy country despite everything that is said. They just dont want us "thinking", and we dont.

by **astradt1** Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:01 pm

I wonder if the fact that all British youth seem to hear from Government, Big Business and others is that they are useless, uneducated and that any qualifications they have were to easy........

Kick someone often enough and they tend to give up.............

by witchfinder Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:16 pm

I also agree with wealth distribution, but of course the realy big problem is that if we took it too far, then it becomes a disincentive to attract wealth, to attract people with money to invest.

For example, this government has cut corporation tax which I believe is a good thing to aim for, if we have a lower corporation tax than our competitors then its more likely we will attract business and jobs.

Now is not the right time to cut taxes to business when individuals are seeing tax increases and are struggling, if and when we can afford to reduce business taxes, then we should do it, but not now.

The governments responsibility is first and foremost to the people, and if people have more spending power then its good for the whole economy.

If you tax business too much, they move to another country. Simples

by bobby Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:52 pm

My first business venture failed along with thousands of others as a direct result of the Bitch Thatcher’s recession, my second attempt failed as a result of the Curry Phucker Major’s recession.
When my first business went tits up I was foolish and naive to still believe the bitch when she kept insisting that everything would be OK and that she would help the thousands of small company’s. With this instead of calling it a day, I kept going, I ended paying my staff with my own personal money and I took nothing, when the end came and I ran out of Money I had to make everyone redundant, locked the door and went home. Not one of the employee’s ever called to ask if I was OK, not even after I lost my home through lack of earnings and 18% interest rate.
I have started again for the third time, only now this country’s economics cant hurt me, in fact I am now paying marginally less for either project cars or spares. And all I produce goes to rich Arabs.
I have extremely good staff and I would do as much to help them as they would to help me, they have good pay and conditions and free holidays provided by me if they wish. However, it was me that took the gamble to start up, it was me working 16 hours a day seven days a week at the beginning, it was me being kept by my wife till the business could afford to pay me anything.
So that said, I will not pay them more, just because I may have an exceptionally good year, and yes my wealth has grown way beyond what my employee’s have, and hopefully will continue for some time. No member of my staff are dissatisfied with what they earn, because they earn good money, and are well rewarded for the work they do.
The thing about the wage differential is being taken out of context by some. The differential can get as big as you like, so long as those that you employ get a fair deal, after all it was myself who started the business, it was me who took the gamble for the third time and it would be me who would stand to lose everything if I went squit.
The differential may of got bigger under New Labour, but we didn’t have the Tory inflicted poverty that is rearing it ugly head again, as we had under the Tory’s the last time they where in, and New Labour didn’t squeeze those lower down to make the rich richer, under new Labour we did have a fairer Society than we could ever hope for under this Fascist style Conservative Government

by witchfinder Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:56 am

bobby

What can I say, I respect you and you are similar to me in that though you run your own business, you dont forget your principles and who you are, where you came from, and what you believe.

I am very proud to say that I was brought up on a council estate, my parents worked hard and had old fashioned values, we were never wealthy by any stretch of the imagination.

People who are willing to take a risk and go into business deserve a pat on the back, but business that exploits people and abuses people deserves to be taught a lesson.

by bobby Thu Feb 02, 2012 1:30 am

but business that exploits people and abuses people deserves to be taught a lesson.

Witchy. The very point I was trying to make in my long winded way, Thank you.

by oftenwrong Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:12 am

Ivanhoe wrote: Britain is a very wealthy country despite everything that is said.

There is firm evidence in support of that statement.
Historically, HM Treasury has always supplemented the Government's income by tapping into people's spare cash. Until recently, savers could tuck their money safely away in tax-free investments offered by the NS & I in the form of Savings Certificates for 2 or 5 years, Premium Bonds, Savings accounts, Inflation-linked investments and the like.

No more. Premium Bonds are the only such product on offer at the moment.

They don't need the money.

by Ivanhoe Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:03 am

oftenwrong wrote:Ivanhoe wrote: Britain is a very wealthy country despite everything that is said.

There is firm evidence in support of that statement.
Historically, HM Treasury has always supplemented the Government's income by tapping into people's spare cash. Until recently, savers could tuck their money safely away in tax-free investments offered by the NS & I in the form of Savings Certificates for 2 or 5 years, Premium Bonds, Savings accounts, Inflation-linked investments and the like.

No more. Premium Bonds are the only such product on offer at the moment.

They don't need the money.

We uphold third world countries. We fight foreign wars. We are sill in Ireland. We send £50+ plus million a day to Europe. We are simply not a poor country.

In my opinion "most" of our GNP is spent elsewhere around the world, while our poor get poorer and our rich get richer, and our own vital services are privatised at a higher cost than nationalisation, because nationalisation puts people to work, where privatisation lays people off, which is what the right wing want.

We British have got this country in a mess, because largely we are not politically motived, we are motivated via "self". Most of us in my opinion, have no idea of the political agenda's we vote for, we tend to vote the way we always have, and we end up being dissolutioned.

by astra Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:33 am

We uphold third world countries

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-16650492

by Ivanhoe Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:42 am

astra wrote:
We uphold third world countries

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-16650492

I have been to the link. Welcome to victorian Britain. Thanks Nick Clegg.

by **astradt1** Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:52 am

So why are British Youth so politically apathetic?

by Ivanhoe Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:18 am

astradt1 wrote:So why are British Youth so politically apathetic?

I believe it's because Britain in general is.

Thatcher was right. We are all capitalists, until the machine that drives us, hits us back, then we dont like it, but by then it's all too late.

by astra Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:46 pm

We Wosint tawt langwagiz at skool, so whi wood dey gib uz pollerticks like?

by **Phil Hornby** Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:51 pm

I have always maintained that the Scottish education system is the envy of the world... Shocked

by atv Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:40 pm

Phil Hornby wrote:I have always maintained that the Scottish education system is the envy of the world...

My Inlaws (Scottish) also claim that perfect English is also best spoken in Scotland.

by oftenwrong Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:19 pm

English people visiting Scotland are advised not to remark upon the "Scots accent" as the general view north of the border is that it is they, the English, who speak with an accent.

by bobby Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:28 pm

atv, The fact they are scottish may be a clue dont you think.

I speak Engerlish with a very cockney accent, The Queens main residency is Buck House in the City o Westminster where I was born, therefore the proppa accent should be like wot I talk.

by oftenwrong Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:36 pm

Dame Shirley Porter forgot that part.

by bobby Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:08 pm

"Dame Shirley Porter forgot that part."

The only name worse than Thatcher for any working class person from Westminster.

by Papaumau Sat Feb 04, 2012 2:32 pm

I think that the eighteen to thirties have been disenfranchised by many governments in the past and as has been said above, "if you are kicked often enough you are inclined to lose interest".

Of course not all of the young people are lost to politics as many university students are interested in politics and they have meetings on various subjects all of the time.

What we need to do is to re-enfranchise the ones that think they are being left out at the moment so that the thoughtful ones no longer feel that they don't have a voice or that if they do the rest of us oldies are actually going to listen to them. ( We don't, much of the time ).

I also think, that like our glorious leader, ( yes I am a Scot ), Alex Salmond, wants the vote to be given to sixteen and seventeen year old's simply because this demographic can and will take an interest if they are given the chance.

I have watched how, when the people are being abused in foreign countries it is usually the university students that take to the streets to protest, and on many occasions, ( Tiananmen Square comes to mind ), many of these interested activists pay with their blood while fighting for their freedom and their political needs.

I believe that that passion is also in the hearts of our youngsters too; all that needs to happen is that that passion needs to be encouraged and directed by us, the ones that have more experience of life.

Regards.....

Papaumau.

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