Can God love? (Part 1)
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agoodman
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Can God love? (Part 1)
First topic message reminder :
Can God love?
We are told that the mythical bible God is love or the epitome of love.
Archetypal Jesus said that we would know his people by the love, deeds and actions they showed others.
Jesus gave us examples of the deeds and works. Feed the poor, love all our neighbours, do not sin and many others.
Love then, seems to Jesus, to be something that must be shown by deeds, actions and works to be alive and true love. Love, like faith, without works is dead. Both St. James and Jesus agree on this.
It follows then that if God is not doing something to show this love then the love for man expressed in scriptures is wrong and God cannot love.
You are in the image of God. When you love someone you show them that love by works and deeds. This is how the recipient of that love knows it is there and that allows for reciprocity. You will agree that without reciprocity, true love cannot exist between two individuals. We must do things for each other for true love to exist.
Imagine what those you love would think if you never did anything to express your love. Imagine what you would think of the love of others towards you if they never did anything to show they loved you. See what I mean. Love always must have deeds to be real and true and reciprocity must be at play.
Love then has no choice but to be expressed if it is true love.
We are told that God loved his son so much that he planned to have him sacrificed even before the earth was created. This human sacrifice or any other human sacrifice, voluntary or not, is immoral and the notion that it is good to sacrifice an innocent victim to give the guilty believers a free ride into heaven is a completely self-gratifying notion and is completely immoral. One does not show love for someone by having them sacrificed for the sins of others when God himself stated that we are all responsible for our own salvation and cannot put that responsibility of the shoulders of a scapegoat Jesus.
Does love need deeds and works to be expressed?
Have you seen God express his love for us lately?
Regards
DL
These following speak to this issue if you wish to view them.
[youtube]
Can God love?
We are told that the mythical bible God is love or the epitome of love.
Archetypal Jesus said that we would know his people by the love, deeds and actions they showed others.
Jesus gave us examples of the deeds and works. Feed the poor, love all our neighbours, do not sin and many others.
Love then, seems to Jesus, to be something that must be shown by deeds, actions and works to be alive and true love. Love, like faith, without works is dead. Both St. James and Jesus agree on this.
It follows then that if God is not doing something to show this love then the love for man expressed in scriptures is wrong and God cannot love.
You are in the image of God. When you love someone you show them that love by works and deeds. This is how the recipient of that love knows it is there and that allows for reciprocity. You will agree that without reciprocity, true love cannot exist between two individuals. We must do things for each other for true love to exist.
Imagine what those you love would think if you never did anything to express your love. Imagine what you would think of the love of others towards you if they never did anything to show they loved you. See what I mean. Love always must have deeds to be real and true and reciprocity must be at play.
Love then has no choice but to be expressed if it is true love.
We are told that God loved his son so much that he planned to have him sacrificed even before the earth was created. This human sacrifice or any other human sacrifice, voluntary or not, is immoral and the notion that it is good to sacrifice an innocent victim to give the guilty believers a free ride into heaven is a completely self-gratifying notion and is completely immoral. One does not show love for someone by having them sacrificed for the sins of others when God himself stated that we are all responsible for our own salvation and cannot put that responsibility of the shoulders of a scapegoat Jesus.
Does love need deeds and works to be expressed?
Have you seen God express his love for us lately?
Regards
DL
These following speak to this issue if you wish to view them.
[youtube]
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Christianity is based on the fact that Jesus came down to earth to inform mankind of the truth.
There is no such foundation for any other religion.
There is no such foundation for any other religion.
polyglide- Posts : 3118
Join date : 2012-02-13
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
polyglide wrote:Of course Shirina you are right in what you say and that is the problem.
In my opinion there is only one God regarding our earth and it is the fact that many Gods having been introduced on many different grounds that has caused most of the conflict between both religions and individuals.
If you believe in creation then you must also believe in a creator, I believe that many of the religions that have been invented are as a result of not wanting to conform to the Christian based church and many in my opinion are run by those with no religious faith whatsoever.
I can see very little chance of everyone coming together as one religion or of one faith because everyone is not after the same thing, if they were,
then a solution could be worked out.
I do not find it odd that many would not want to follow and emulate a genocidal son murdering God who has a policy of punishing the innocent and not the guilty.
Do you?
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
polyglide wrote:Christianity is based on the fact that Jesus came down to earth to inform mankind of the truth.
There is no such foundation for any other religion.
???
Jesus was what, the 6th man said to be the son of God and born of a virgin?
You do not study the other religions much do you?
Almost nothing in Christianity is original. It was all plagiarize from older myths and religions.
Listen to what this bishop says of both Mary and Jesus.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AfFcAmx-Ro&feature=relmfu
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
There is no other religion where there is factual evidence of the existance of an actual person who performed the miracles that Jesus did nor who made the same propmises.
Of course there has been and always will be false religions and false prophets as indincated in the Bible you just have to sort the dross out.
regards.
Of course there has been and always will be false religions and false prophets as indincated in the Bible you just have to sort the dross out.
regards.
polyglide- Posts : 3118
Join date : 2012-02-13
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
polyglide wrote:There is no other religion where there is factual evidence of the existance of an actual person who performed the miracles that Jesus did nor who made the same propmises.
Of course there has been and always will be false religions and false prophets as indincated in the Bible you just have to sort the dross out.
regards.
There is no religion where there is factual evidence of the existance of an actual person who performed miracles.
I agree.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Do you think he'll spot that?
oftenwrong- Sage
- Posts : 12062
Join date : 2011-10-08
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Other than Jesus, where there there is ample evidence both physical and historical.
Thanks for confirming all the others you refered to were not, that saves me having to ask how and why.
There is more ways of skinniung a cat than one.
Thanks for confirming all the others you refered to were not, that saves me having to ask how and why.
There is more ways of skinniung a cat than one.
polyglide- Posts : 3118
Join date : 2012-02-13
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
polyglide wrote:Other than Jesus, where there there is ample evidence both physical and historical.
Thanks for confirming all the others you refered to were not, that saves me having to ask how and why.
There is more ways of skinniung a cat than one.
Hearsay from a 3.000 year old book is evidence only to ----------
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Greatest I am wrote:polyglide wrote:Christianity is based on the fact that Jesus came down to earth to inform mankind of the truth.
There is no such foundation for any other religion.
???
Jesus was what, the 6th man said to be the son of God and born of a virgin?
You do not study the other religions much do you?
Almost nothing in Christianity is original. It was all plagiarize from older myths and religions.
DL
The sheep are still lost...
I wonder what it is about the human mind that means so many have to look to others for the truth. The truth is inside each and every one of us, in plain sight, yet most fail to see. It seems that Jesus (no idea if the Biblical Jesus really existed, nor do I care, it's not the point) was one man, possibly the 6th and most recent, to repeat the Christ-archtype. It's the story that matters, because stories aid insight and understanding of truth better than the kind of conceptual verbosity I'm about to use... Lol...
'The Truth' that mankind has failed to realise on mass as of yet is indeed inside each of us. It's simply our own personal realisation of our True Identity. Truth cannot be told, it can only be found by direct personal realisation. Most humans still believe it can be told but it can't. However, it can be pointed to, so our attention is brought to the truth that exists inside us. So here's a pointer. It's not The Truth, but it is quite an accurate representation of what is true. Pay attention.
As I scanned through this thread and read the questions, answers, speculations and assertions I felt sad at the lack of understanding that so many still have of who and what God is. I must admit I'm a bit of a metaphysics geek, but to me it's so clear, especially when I look into a clear night sky. I recognise that I am an individuated but undivided part of the Universe/Creation/Nature/All-That-Is looking back at itself. This Singular Conscious Unity can go by any name, one of which is 'God'. The religious texts are quite correct, God is the Creator, but also the Created. God/the Universe/Creation/Nature/All-That-Is is that which creates Itself. Through the process of existential self-relation, the One (actually we can't really call it the One, as without a Two, One cannot be named) 'plays hide-and-seek' with Itself and becomes the many. This is our True Identity. We are Not-Two!
Here's a visual metaphor in action, which I made through applying the principle of 'self-relation'. When a singular input/output 'entity' (video camera) looks back at itself, something remarkably complex and beautiful spontaneously pops into existence, and then out again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2HDfum7JrU&feature=plcp
The understanding of this, if not the realisation, is gained from the understanding of fractals and holograms:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1o5FMTHkLQg&feature=related
The All is in the One, the One is in the All.
History has been a process of human consciousness evolving from the most primitive consciousness of survival (of that which fits best) towards the highest consciousness. This highest form of consciousness arises through self-realisation, or direct revelation; a knowing and experiencing ourselves as different but undivided, separate but in unity. That's a pretty good definition of Christ-consciousness I think. How long will it take all of us to get there? Who can say, but it's only a thought away. We are all Christs, everyone of us Buddha's, we just don't think we are. It's comes down to the power of thought. Thought is creative, and each of us is created in the image and likeness of our Creator, so we too have the power of conscious creation. Afterall, a wave is exactly the same stuff as the ocean, and has just the same kind of power, but in proportionally smaller measure. This is true of human beings too. Gettit?
As for God's love, well the word love can be used in so many different ways. I see love as a feeling of increasing unity, and fear and pain are the feelings of increasing separation. If we are all parts of God, we are the same conscious, creative, energy as God, and God is unified within us, experiencing Itself, in, as and through us... in love with us... Make sense?
I hope these words, these imperfect signposts inspire some realisation with you. Even without a significant spiritual realisation, the logic stands for itself, and should allow us to upgrade our outdated and inaccurate beliefs, which create behaviours that are killing us. Of course, if we know our True Identity, even that doesn't matter. Our True Identity is 'outside' space and time, was never born and will never die. Which ultimately is good news.. eh..?
Peace
agoodman- Posts : 9
Join date : 2012-07-07
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Aaaaaaaaaaahmen.
basso profundo
basso profundo
oftenwrong- Sage
- Posts : 12062
Join date : 2011-10-08
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
agoodman wrote:Greatest I am wrote:polyglide wrote:Christianity is based on the fact that Jesus came down to earth to inform mankind of the truth.
There is no such foundation for any other religion.
???
Jesus was what, the 6th man said to be the son of God and born of a virgin?
You do not study the other religions much do you?
Almost nothing in Christianity is original. It was all plagiarize from older myths and religions.
DL
The sheep are still lost...
I wonder what it is about the human mind that means so many have to look to others for the truth. The truth is inside each and every one of us, in plain sight, yet most fail to see. It seems that Jesus (no idea if the Biblical Jesus really existed, nor do I care, it's not the point) was one man, possibly the 6th and most recent, to repeat the Christ-archtype. It's the story that matters, because stories aid insight and understanding of truth better than the kind of conceptual verbosity I'm about to use... Lol...
'The Truth' that mankind has failed to realise on mass as of yet is indeed inside each of us. It's simply our own personal realisation of our True Identity. Truth cannot be told, it can only be found by direct personal realisation. Most humans still believe it can be told but it can't. However, it can be pointed to, so our attention is brought to the truth that exists inside us. So here's a pointer. It's not The Truth, but it is quite an accurate representation of what is true. Pay attention.
As I scanned through this thread and read the questions, answers, speculations and assertions I felt sad at the lack of understanding that so many still have of who and what God is. I must admit I'm a bit of a metaphysics geek, but to me it's so clear, especially when I look into a clear night sky. I recognise that I am an individuated but undivided part of the Universe/Creation/Nature/All-That-Is looking back at itself. This Singular Conscious Unity can go by any name, one of which is 'God'. The religious texts are quite correct, God is the Creator, but also the Created. God/the Universe/Creation/Nature/All-That-Is is that which creates Itself. Through the process of existential self-relation, the One (actually we can't really call it the One, as without a Two, One cannot be named) 'plays hide-and-seek' with Itself and becomes the many. This is our True Identity. We are Not-Two!
Here's a visual metaphor in action, which I made through applying the principle of 'self-relation'. When a singular input/output 'entity' (video camera) looks back at itself, something remarkably complex and beautiful spontaneously pops into existence, and then out again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2HDfum7JrU&feature=plcp
The understanding of this, if not the realisation, is gained from the understanding of fractals and holograms:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1o5FMTHkLQg&feature=related
The All is in the One, the One is in the All.
History has been a process of human consciousness evolving from the most primitive consciousness of survival (of that which fits best) towards the highest consciousness. This highest form of consciousness arises through self-realisation, or direct revelation; a knowing and experiencing ourselves as different but undivided, separate but in unity. That's a pretty good definition of Christ-consciousness I think. How long will it take all of us to get there? Who can say, but it's only a thought away. We are all Christs, everyone of us Buddha's, we just don't think we are. It's comes down to the power of thought. Thought is creative, and each of us is created in the image and likeness of our Creator, so we too have the power of conscious creation. Afterall, a wave is exactly the same stuff as the ocean, and has just the same kind of power, but in proportionally smaller measure. This is true of human beings too. Gettit?
As for God's love, well the word love can be used in so many different ways. I see love as a feeling of increasing unity, and fear and pain are the feelings of increasing separation. If we are all parts of God, we are the same conscious, creative, energy as God, and God is unified within us, experiencing Itself, in, as and through us... in love with us... Make sense?
I hope these words, these imperfect signposts inspire some realisation with you. Even without a significant spiritual realisation, the logic stands for itself, and should allow us to upgrade our outdated and inaccurate beliefs, which create behaviours that are killing us. Of course, if we know our True Identity, even that doesn't matter. Our True Identity is 'outside' space and time, was never born and will never die. Which ultimately is good news.. eh..?
Peace
Always good to find a good mind.
You are damn near bright enough to be a Gnostic Christian like myself.
Just kidding. Nice work though.
You, like quite a few people of spirituality as opposed to religious have hung onto metaphysics. So have I and I was rewarded with proof that there is something unseen that we just do not know about yet. I have no proof to show yet but I would encourage you not to drop it.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
I am going to make a U turn here and now gang and invite your thoughts on this new tact that I have taken if you can understand what I wrote. I admit to poor success to this point in time.
Because of this, I hope I am not wasting anyone's time.
God loves the evil ones more than the good because he is the greatest sinner.
This love of sinners is the hinge pin on which his benevolent qualities depend and without evil and sin, God could never expressed his benevolence and we would never know of God’s mercy, forgiveness, compassion and all his other positive attributes. Love, like faith, can only be expressed by actions and for God to show his love of sinners and his other positive attributes, evil, sin and sinners must exist to receive this love.
Before the earth was formed, God planned to have Jesus sacrificed, murdered in fact, for those of us who are sinners. That is all of us. Jesus’ sacrifice was to be God’s example of the greatest evil and sin from the point of view of all who are wise. It shows our greatest loss and evil if we were to do as God did. Those of us who are evil without knowing good will try to profit from this greatest evil. We are to venerate life. Not take it or try to profit from its death. Though shalt not kill or try to profit from it.
As above so below.
The fact that God created evil and sin is a given. He created all that is to those who believe he exists. He decides what is evil or not and therefore sets this as our standard. It is a human standard. God is man.
Have you forgotten that you are to be a God by emulating your heavenly father?
Sin by the thought of having your child killed or profiting from someone else’s doing so and repent as God did.
All fathers or parent will know that the greatest evil he can experience is to have his children die before he does. Having them killed is the greatest sin that any entity can do. Including God himself. As the Alpha, God knew he had to do this to also be the Omega. That is a part of the full standard of good and evil as declared by God as the law maker.
This shows that he loves sinners more than those of us who are supposedly good. Think of the prodigal son myth here. Those who know their evil ways will know this. Those who do not will think they are good and will accept this greatest evil for their salvation. A completely immoral act by all moral standards as set by God and man.
http://blog.ted.com/2008/09/17/the_real_differ/
God planned to have Adam and Eve expelled from the Garden of Eden and placed his beloved Satan near the tree of knowledge to insure that mankind ate of it. To make sure of this, God gave Satan the power to deceive all of us including Adam and Eve. As history shows, his plan was a great success. Dominion over the earth was Satan’s reward and gift from God for aiding in this great success. Evil is our lord and God as shown by God’s actions. Satan is not real of course but as the personification of evil, rules us. That is scripture.
The great value of sinners is that we set the standards for the good. Without us, we would all be living in what we would call hell instead of the paradise that we have created thanks to sin and the evils we do. This maintains the perfection of all that is. This explains why God loves the sinner and hates the sin and this is also why we are rewarded with the eternal paradise of hell. Remember that fire, in the beginning, was prized as the greatest purifying force known to us. It still is. Evolution and creation began in the fires of the big bang.
Martin Luther, A Gnostic Christian and founder of the Protestant movement may, have been aware of this. He said, “Be a sinner and sin strongly, but more strongly have faith and rejoice in Christ.” In this though we must remember what Jesus said. That to think of sin is to do it and hopefully learn morals from the experience. We are to sin that way and not do the actual act. There should not be a need to do so.
I invite you to follow the bible advice ---- 1 Thessalonians. 5:21; “Test all things".
If you will only give a dogmatic kneejerk denial of this theory then please ignore this post.
Please test the logic of what I have written even as it goes against you dogma and traditional thinking. God is good but just not the God you think he is. The root of all religions is the Great Arcanum and this theory fit’s it perfectly in my opinion.
http://www.sacred-sex.org/scriptures/judaism/122-the-ark-of-the-covenant.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhKVElO8JGo&feature=related
Offsprings and their great value are the driving force of all religions. Those who would profit from the murder or sacrifice of the offspring, archetypal Jesus, are knowing evil without knowing good and are thus evil in their hearts.
Christians. Most of you are basically good. Please stop doing evil and sinning in your thoughts of profiting from God’s sacrifice and murder of his innocent son. You are missing the moral of the myth and calling evil good. This thinking will send you to hell.
Regards
DL
Because of this, I hope I am not wasting anyone's time.
God loves the evil ones more than the good because he is the greatest sinner.
This love of sinners is the hinge pin on which his benevolent qualities depend and without evil and sin, God could never expressed his benevolence and we would never know of God’s mercy, forgiveness, compassion and all his other positive attributes. Love, like faith, can only be expressed by actions and for God to show his love of sinners and his other positive attributes, evil, sin and sinners must exist to receive this love.
Before the earth was formed, God planned to have Jesus sacrificed, murdered in fact, for those of us who are sinners. That is all of us. Jesus’ sacrifice was to be God’s example of the greatest evil and sin from the point of view of all who are wise. It shows our greatest loss and evil if we were to do as God did. Those of us who are evil without knowing good will try to profit from this greatest evil. We are to venerate life. Not take it or try to profit from its death. Though shalt not kill or try to profit from it.
As above so below.
The fact that God created evil and sin is a given. He created all that is to those who believe he exists. He decides what is evil or not and therefore sets this as our standard. It is a human standard. God is man.
Have you forgotten that you are to be a God by emulating your heavenly father?
Sin by the thought of having your child killed or profiting from someone else’s doing so and repent as God did.
All fathers or parent will know that the greatest evil he can experience is to have his children die before he does. Having them killed is the greatest sin that any entity can do. Including God himself. As the Alpha, God knew he had to do this to also be the Omega. That is a part of the full standard of good and evil as declared by God as the law maker.
This shows that he loves sinners more than those of us who are supposedly good. Think of the prodigal son myth here. Those who know their evil ways will know this. Those who do not will think they are good and will accept this greatest evil for their salvation. A completely immoral act by all moral standards as set by God and man.
http://blog.ted.com/2008/09/17/the_real_differ/
God planned to have Adam and Eve expelled from the Garden of Eden and placed his beloved Satan near the tree of knowledge to insure that mankind ate of it. To make sure of this, God gave Satan the power to deceive all of us including Adam and Eve. As history shows, his plan was a great success. Dominion over the earth was Satan’s reward and gift from God for aiding in this great success. Evil is our lord and God as shown by God’s actions. Satan is not real of course but as the personification of evil, rules us. That is scripture.
The great value of sinners is that we set the standards for the good. Without us, we would all be living in what we would call hell instead of the paradise that we have created thanks to sin and the evils we do. This maintains the perfection of all that is. This explains why God loves the sinner and hates the sin and this is also why we are rewarded with the eternal paradise of hell. Remember that fire, in the beginning, was prized as the greatest purifying force known to us. It still is. Evolution and creation began in the fires of the big bang.
Martin Luther, A Gnostic Christian and founder of the Protestant movement may, have been aware of this. He said, “Be a sinner and sin strongly, but more strongly have faith and rejoice in Christ.” In this though we must remember what Jesus said. That to think of sin is to do it and hopefully learn morals from the experience. We are to sin that way and not do the actual act. There should not be a need to do so.
I invite you to follow the bible advice ---- 1 Thessalonians. 5:21; “Test all things".
If you will only give a dogmatic kneejerk denial of this theory then please ignore this post.
Please test the logic of what I have written even as it goes against you dogma and traditional thinking. God is good but just not the God you think he is. The root of all religions is the Great Arcanum and this theory fit’s it perfectly in my opinion.
http://www.sacred-sex.org/scriptures/judaism/122-the-ark-of-the-covenant.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhKVElO8JGo&feature=related
Offsprings and their great value are the driving force of all religions. Those who would profit from the murder or sacrifice of the offspring, archetypal Jesus, are knowing evil without knowing good and are thus evil in their hearts.
Christians. Most of you are basically good. Please stop doing evil and sinning in your thoughts of profiting from God’s sacrifice and murder of his innocent son. You are missing the moral of the myth and calling evil good. This thinking will send you to hell.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
The clergy are of course committed to "the word of God"if that is what the congregation requires, but appear willing to modifty their views.
But what is the point of abstract appeals to HUMAN NATURE?
But what is the point of abstract appeals to HUMAN NATURE?
oftenwrong- Sage
- Posts : 12062
Join date : 2011-10-08
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
oftenwrong wrote:The clergy are of course committed to "the word of God"if that is what the congregation requires, but appear willing to modifty their views.
For sure. Even to the point of being forced to feed their hate of other tribes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lv_rmQuagpY&feature=player_embedded
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baGwwma5VZo&feature=relatedBut what is the point of abstract appeals to HUMAN NATURE?
Is religion not supposed to be all about human nature and improving human characters?
I think so. So using abstracts, myths, analogies or any of the other possible tools should be fair play.
No?
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
Join date : 2012-04-25
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
But what is the point of abstract appeals to HUMAN NATURE?
Those appeals did not work in the death camps in Germany or Poland, or on the Burma Railway either.
astra- Deceased
- Posts : 1864
Join date : 2011-10-07
Location : North East England.
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Greatest I am wrote:
Re: Can God love?
by Greatest I am on Thu 12 Jul 2012 - 20:53
I invite you to follow the bible advice ---- 1 Thessalonians. 5:21; “Test all things".
Allow me to “test” your use of a tiny portion of the entire thought communicated to the ecclesia at Thessalonica by Saul of Tarsus, called Paul, an apostle of Y’shua Moshiach, Jesus the Christ.
Greek Bible:
“But we request of you, brethren, that you appreciate those who diligently labor among you, and have charge over you in the Lord and give you instruction, and that you esteem them very highly in love because of their work.”
“Live in peace with one another.”
“We urge you, brethren, admonish the unruly, encourage the fainthearted, help the weak, be patient with everyone. See that no one repays another with evil for evil, but always seek after that which is good for one another and for all people.”
“Rejoice always; pray without ceasing; in everything give thanks, for this is God’s will for you in Christ Jesus.”
“Do not quench the Spirit; do not despise prophetic utterances. [But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good; abstain from every form of evil.”
1 Thessalonians 5:12-22
Examination of Paul’s entire thought as recorded belies your out of context misuse of Paul’s communication to the ecclesia at Thessalonica.
Last edited by RockOnBrother on Sat Jul 14, 2012 12:30 am; edited 5 times in total
Guest- Guest
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Re: Can God love?
by Greatest I am Today at 8:53 pm
.I am going to make a U turn here and now gang and invite your thoughts on this new tact that I have taken if you can understand what I wrote. I admit to poor success to this point in time.................................
Well done Greatest. Nearly as good as Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows.
Whoosh...gone.
by Greatest I am Today at 8:53 pm
.I am going to make a U turn here and now gang and invite your thoughts on this new tact that I have taken if you can understand what I wrote. I admit to poor success to this point in time.................................
Well done Greatest. Nearly as good as Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows.
Whoosh...gone.
trevorw2539- Posts : 1374
Join date : 2011-11-03
Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
The whole point that is being missed, as I have tried to explain previously, is the fact that God is not the only player in the whole scenario.
It is like having a 15 round boxing match and only considering the actions of one of those involved and dismissing the damage caused by the other.
The Devil is also at work and is involved in all the apparent and obvious henious and abhorent happenings throughout the world.
I am afraid we are in the 15th round of the fight between the Devil and God and there is little time to make your decision.
It is like having a 15 round boxing match and only considering the actions of one of those involved and dismissing the damage caused by the other.
The Devil is also at work and is involved in all the apparent and obvious henious and abhorent happenings throughout the world.
I am afraid we are in the 15th round of the fight between the Devil and God and there is little time to make your decision.
polyglide- Posts : 3118
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
polyglide wrote:The whole point that is being missed, as I have tried to explain previously, is the fact that God is not the only player in the whole scenario.
It is like having a 15 round boxing match and only considering the actions of one of those involved and dismissing the damage caused by the other.
The Devil is also at work and is involved in all the apparent and obvious henious and abhorent happenings throughout the world.
I am afraid we are in the 15th round of the fight between the Devil and God and there is little time to make your decision.
Hi polyglide,
Are you sure of this fact? What assumptions do you base that on? What are your assumptions about Who and What God is? How do you define the word 'God'?
The fact is that Unity is the ultimate truth. All things are part of the Whole. The Whole is comprised of many parts. Each part is simultaneously a part and the Whole. This is Non-duality, or Advaita in Hindu philosophy. It cannot be otherwise, except in our illusory dualistic perception. Non-dual perception leads to liberation.
The reason things are the way they are in the world is because God/Life/Unity is ever growing, expanding and complexifying. It cannot be otherwise. Growth can only occur when there is a resistence. The ever expanding complexity within God/Life/Unity necessarily contains the duality of light and dark, male and female, up and down, love and fear, good and evil, life and death.
What you call 'the Devil' is a part of God/Life/Unity, used as a tool to become more of Itself. But I agree, we are in your metaphorical 15th round of the struggle, and it will be over soon but the outcome is assured because in non-dual truth, there really is only one player.
Blessings...
agoodman- Posts : 9
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
astra wrote:But what is the point of abstract appeals to HUMAN NATURE?
Those appeals did not work in the death camps in Germany or Poland, or on the Burma Railway either.
True. The Jesuits running the show ignored it all.
Or were those other death camps? I have forgotten just how many atrocities Christianity has been involved in.
Regards
DL
Greatest I am- Posts : 1087
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
RockOnBrother wrote:[
Examination of Paul’s entire thought as recorded belies your out of context misuse of Paul’s communication to the ecclesia at Thessalonica.
[/color]
Scholarly examination of the text show it to be forgeries and plagiarisms.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xH93PSZ6fQ
And examination of Jewish text shows that they knew they were writing myths that only the uninformed would read literally.
Regards
DL
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
polyglide wrote:The whole point that is being missed, as I have tried to explain previously, is the fact that God is not the only player in the whole scenario.
It is like having a 15 round boxing match and only considering the actions of one of those involved and dismissing the damage caused by the other.
The Devil is also at work and is involved in all the apparent and obvious henious and abhorent happenings throughout the world.
I am afraid we are in the 15th round of the fight between the Devil and God and there is little time to make your decision.
Satan has been sentenced to hell according to the myth.
Justice delayed is justice denied so God must want him here and as stated above, it looks like he rewarded him by giving him dominion here after clawing it back from mankind.
Quite the ------------
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78H-tRFShiY
Regards
DL
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
RockOnBrother wrote:
Re: Can God love?
by RockOnBrother on Thu 12 Jul 2012 - 23:27Allow me to “test” your use of a tiny portion of the entire thought communicated to the ecclesia at Thessalonica by Saul of Tarsus, called Paul, an apostle of Y’shua Moshiach, Jesus the Christ.Greatest I am wrote:
Re: Can God love?
by Greatest I am on Thu 12 Jul 2012 - 20:53
I invite you to follow the bible advice ---- 1 Thessalonians. 5:21; “Test all things".Greek Bible:
“But we request of you, brethren, that you appreciate those who diligently labor among you, and have charge over you in the Lord and give you instruction, and that you esteem them very highly in love because of their work.”
“Live in peace with one another.”
“We urge you, brethren, admonish the unruly, encourage the fainthearted, help the weak, be patient with everyone. See that no one repays another with evil for evil, but always seek after that which is good for one another and for all people.”
“Rejoice always; pray without ceasing; in everything give thanks, for this is God’s will for you in Christ Jesus.”
“Do not quench the Spirit; do not despise prophetic utterances. [But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good; abstain from every form of evil.”
1 Thessalonians 5:12-22
Examination of Paul’s entire thought as recorded belies your out of context misuse of Paul’s communication to the ecclesia at Thessalonica.
Greatest I am’s response:
Greatest I am wrote:
Re: Can God love?
by Greatest I am on Fri 13 Jul 2012 - 16:49RockOnBrother wrote:[
Examination of Paul’s entire thought as recorded belies your out of context misuse of Paul’s communication to the ecclesia at Thessalonica.
Scholarly examination of the text show it to be forgeries and plagiarisms.
Comparison of Greatest I am’s statements of Thursday, 12 July 2012 at 20:53 and Friday, 13 July 2012 at 16:49.
- Greatest I am’s statement of Thursday, 12 July 2012 at 20:53, quoted by me Thursday, 12 July 2012 at 23:27: “I invite you to follow the bible advice ---- 1 Thessalonians. 5:21; ‘Test all things.’”
- Greatest I am’s statement of Friday, 13 July 2012 at 16:49: “Scholarly examination of the text show it to be forgeries and plagiarisms.”
Identification of “the text” which Greatest I am characterizes as “forgeries and plagiarisms” in #2 shows it to be the same text, “1 Thessalonians. 5:21”, which Greatest I am “invite[s]” others “to follow the bible advice” thereof, “Test all things”, in #1.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
There is one thing for certain, if God did not love and show compassion in many cases, the world as evil as is presently is, would be far worse for everyone concerned, it is only by those who believe and ask God to guide and help them that we have any kind of civilisation.
God can only help those who ask for his help.
God can only help those who ask for his help.
polyglide- Posts : 3118
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
I think people help themselves Polyglide...Good and bad people.
Lets face it...If for some reason I asked God for help and then just sat there and waited, I would be waiting for eternity
Lets face it...If for some reason I asked God for help and then just sat there and waited, I would be waiting for eternity
blueturando- Banned
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Faith is a wonderful thing. Without it you will certainly be waiting forever.
This is the problem with the majority of people today, they have no faith and therefore unfortunately turn to the best and fasted solution for THEMSELVES---GREED.
This is the problem with the majority of people today, they have no faith and therefore unfortunately turn to the best and fasted solution for THEMSELVES---GREED.
Mel- Posts : 1703
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
There are plenty of non-Christian civilizations that are doing just fine. In fact, many of them are on the rise while we, especially in hyper-religious Christian America, are on the decline. There doesn't seem to be any correlation between civilization and religious belief - except that societies that are extremely religious tend to do very poorly, fraught with civil unrest, corruption, oppression, rampant poverty, and discrimination.it is only by those who believe and ask God to guide and help them that we have any kind of civilisation.
Shirina- Former Administrator
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
I'm not so sure about that, Mel. Religion and greed seem to be pretty much synonymous, and there are plenty of examples from the opulence of the Catholic Vatican to the grand palaces of rigid Muslim Saudi princes to the gleaming stadium-size mega-churches owned by "reverends" living in multi-million dollar houses here in the US. Wherever you find religion and faith you also seem to find plenty of personal greed. In fact, here in the States, the two have become dependent on each other. The greedier you are, the more "blessed" you must be.This is the problem with the majority of people today, they have no faith and therefore unfortunately turn to the best and fasted solution for THEMSELVES---GREED.
I know from interacting with hundreds of so-called Christians in America that they are the first people to throw fits about their taxes going to help the poor. After all, the poor are all lazy deadbeats, dontchya know, and live on welfare while driving expensive cars and possessing more luxuries than most middle class people! Instead, they would rather have that tax money for themselves - even though they already have a life free from want (by their own admission). But hey, they stopped by a homeless shelter and gave someone a blanket, so that makes their greed perfectly okay! And these are the Christians.
And, in all seriousness, how many people really pray for the homeless, the poor, the disabled, and the oppressed before crawling into their comfy bed in their comfy home? I doubt very many do. Even their faith is relatively greedy; most of them pray only for strength for themselves or confess their sins. If they pray for others at all, it is only for those in their inner circle - an aunt in the hospital or a nephew in the military. Perhaps a few people in their church prayer group will receive an honorable mention.
Yes, I know not all religious people are that way, but at least where I live, most of them are.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Stop me if you've heard this before. Charity begins at home.
oftenwrong- Sage
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
And for most, that's where it stays.Charity begins at home.
Shirina- Former Administrator
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
It is the lack of faith that causes all the problems not faith itself.
polyglide- Posts : 3118
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
"Charity begins at home."
How true that is. Of course self preservation in most cases except perhaps for heros and close family comes first, but where has the love of thy neighbour dissapeared to?
In my book the fear of God was for many (not all) was adhered to in the past. Children had manners, respect for others and indeed themselves.
Look at the way the majority dress themselves today, Tee shirts at Theatres and god knows where else including interviews for jobs etc. Decency and morality has gone out of the window, replaced by greed and lack of care and responsibility.
The sixties were the start of all this and Thatcher finished the job with the dog eat dog attitude.
The upbringing with the fear of God brought about gratitude and respect, today we have neither.
How true that is. Of course self preservation in most cases except perhaps for heros and close family comes first, but where has the love of thy neighbour dissapeared to?
In my book the fear of God was for many (not all) was adhered to in the past. Children had manners, respect for others and indeed themselves.
Look at the way the majority dress themselves today, Tee shirts at Theatres and god knows where else including interviews for jobs etc. Decency and morality has gone out of the window, replaced by greed and lack of care and responsibility.
The sixties were the start of all this and Thatcher finished the job with the dog eat dog attitude.
The upbringing with the fear of God brought about gratitude and respect, today we have neither.
Mel- Posts : 1703
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
It's unlikely that people lacking in self-respect will show much respect to others. The downside for them is likely to be difficulty in earning a decent living, which regrettably encourages even worse behaviour through inchoate frustration.
oftenwrong- Sage
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
In my book the fear of God was for many (not all) was adhered to in the past. Children had manners, respect for others and indeed themselves.
Well, I have to disagree with you here, Mel. God didn't have anything to do with this. Children feared being whipped half to death with a tree branch more so than they feared God. Besides, when God is used as a bogyman under the bed to scare children, we've already lost sight of what God is supposed to be - the embodiment of love, not fear. I think the notion of "fearing" God is one thing that drives people into the arms of atheism. I don't wish to live my life in fear of a wrathful deity, do you? And trying to "love" a deity "with all your heart" as the Bible commands yet knowing you're scared to death of this being, that is a dichotomy many simply cannot deal with.
The irony here, Mel, is that your complaint about how people dress defeats your own argument. People didn't dress up for the theatre to impress or appease God. They did it to impress each other with their wealth. The fancier the clothes, the more wealthy you were, and people wanted everyone to know just how much money they had. THAT is part and parcel of greed, the very thing you claim has taken over our lives by dressing down with t-shirts. You know I respect you, but the point you're making here really isn't very logical.Look at the way the majority dress themselves today, Tee shirts at Theatres and god knows where else including interviews for jobs etc. Decency and morality has gone out of the window, replaced by greed and lack of care and responsibility.
In addition, whether you wear a t-shirt or a tux has absolutely nothing to do with morality. I, for one, am glad people no longer dress in formal attire to go sit in the dark with a bunch of strangers. That seems like such a waste of time to be engaged in something so pointless. The theatre used to be something only the wealthy could afford, and if we reverted back to those days, it would be so again. In economic times such as these, people are lucky to even afford a theatre ticket much less the very expensive attire to go with it. Men, sure, they can rent a tux for $50, but women have to buy their dresses to the tune of hundreds of dollars. No thanks! My prom dress in high school was $390 and I wore it once.
I know people in the past tended to dress better on a regular basis than they do today, but I see the fashion world for precisely what it is: A transparent competition to show off one's financial success, not to appease God or to demonstrate morality.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Sorry, polyglide, but that's a baseless statement. There is nothing to indicate that atheists are the cause of all the world's problems. In fact, the opposite is true. If you look around the world at where most of the violence, war, and bloodshed is taking place, you'll find faith and religion at the core. People arguing over their differing god concepts has been the basis for countless millions of deaths, not to mention persecution, oppression, discrimination, and plain and simple bullying.It is the lack of faith that causes all the problems not faith itself.
Shirina- Former Administrator
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Shirina, Perhaps I should have said---fear of losing the love of God, perhaps that is more apropriate.
I too respect your views, however, they are IMO somewhat misguided.
Self esteem and respect not only for oneself, parents, teachers, the elderly, the sick and the feeble, along with respect for God and the Ten Commandments, is sadly missing in this country and perhaps in the USA.
The poor probably more so than the rich were God loving in years gone by.
Decency was top of the agenda. Yes there was exploitation of the poor by the rich and yes I agree religion has created wars and has been and is still full of hypcrites. If we had even only 60% of the population adhering to Gods wishes, then we would have a better place to live in with better people in it.
Your argument re dress I do not agree with. Good dress sense goes along
with cleanliness. To be seen clean rather than dirty surely matters to oneself and to others, it is not nesessarily done to "impress others" on wealth status as it may well have been many moons ago.
I too respect your views, however, they are IMO somewhat misguided.
Self esteem and respect not only for oneself, parents, teachers, the elderly, the sick and the feeble, along with respect for God and the Ten Commandments, is sadly missing in this country and perhaps in the USA.
The poor probably more so than the rich were God loving in years gone by.
Decency was top of the agenda. Yes there was exploitation of the poor by the rich and yes I agree religion has created wars and has been and is still full of hypcrites. If we had even only 60% of the population adhering to Gods wishes, then we would have a better place to live in with better people in it.
Your argument re dress I do not agree with. Good dress sense goes along
with cleanliness. To be seen clean rather than dirty surely matters to oneself and to others, it is not nesessarily done to "impress others" on wealth status as it may well have been many moons ago.
Mel- Posts : 1703
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
[quote="Shirina"]
Interestingly, MSN are currently running a Poll in Britain asking whether there should be a Law preventing parents from chastising children. More than 80% reject the idea of a legal prohibition. (Though European Law already forbids it).
.... God didn't have anything to do with this. Children feared being whipped half to death with a tree branch more so than they feared God.
Interestingly, MSN are currently running a Poll in Britain asking whether there should be a Law preventing parents from chastising children. More than 80% reject the idea of a legal prohibition. (Though European Law already forbids it).
oftenwrong- Sage
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
But this assumes that everyone in the country should be Christian and the lack of respect is due to not being Christian rather than simply being nasty people. This is just a slight variation on the oft-heard argument that non-Christians have no morality - which is, of course, dead-bang wrong. In the USA, it is not respect for God that is lacking but respect for each other. The Ten Commandments comes from the Old Testament, a book that focuses on a wrathful God dealing death and destruction at the drop of a hat. The only love there is the type commanded by God to be shown to him, not love and respect for each other. Notice how "love they neighbor as you would love yourself" is NOT found in the 10 Commandments. Americans are fixated on the Old Testament and completely ignore the New Testament; all they care about is monitoring other peoples' sins and casting judgment upon their neighbors, not loving or respecting them. According to the 10 Commandments, all they have to do is love and respect their parents and God, no one else. This attitude has extended even into the political arena.Self esteem and respect not only for oneself, parents, teachers, the elderly, the sick and the feeble, along with respect for God and the Ten Commandments, is sadly missing in this country and perhaps in the USA.
In the USA, our biggest Christian leaders do nothing but preach hatred, intolerance, and prejudice. They blame natural disasters on liberals, feminists, and the gays. They openly talk of imprisoning or even killing homosexuals. They are preoccupied with sexual sin and virtually ignore the plight of the poor - and they certainly don't give a hoot about the right for non-Christians to make their own choices. They openly mock and disdain other religions - Pat Robertson, a televangelist with millions of viewers, told a caller once on national television to destroy all of her friend's Buddha statues. Never mind the fact that the caller's friend was Buddhist, and never mind the fact that destroying someone else's property is a criminal offense. Oh, and never mind the fact that the Taliban destroyed those huge Buddhist statues in Afghanistan a few months before 9/11. Funny how American Christians are becoming the very same religious fascists that we've been fighting against for 10 years now. And if that weren't enough, American Christianity is apocalyptic. Many of them want to believe that the End of Days is just around the corner, and that alters the mood of the entire country. The belief that the "end is nigh" is paralyzing, it diminishes optimism for the future, it casts a pall of doom over the entire population whether you believe in this junk or not, and what's worse, it tends to cause self-fulfilling prophesies.
Perhaps British Christianity is different from American Christianity, but here ... Christianity is running amok and nothing good is coming of it.
One of the best quotes of all time:
"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross." -- Sinclair Lewis
I suppose the bottom line here is that we need a moral compass that isn't jaded by Bronze Age and non-Western ideas of what morality should be. We need to find a system that works for us, now, not a series of baffling rules written exclusively for Hebrews in the Middle East 3,000 years ago. The result of clinging to the Bible is that we have written and re-written it again and again trying to make it work in contemporary times, and we have to acknowledge that it is always subject to change. Because we have not done this, we both cherry pick and interpret the Bible to suit our own ends. As was said once by a theologian: "The Bible is like a human being - torture it long enough and you can get it to say anything."
No, we wouldn't have a better place with better people, Mel. Do you know why? It's because no one can agree on which of God's wishes to adhere to and which not to. I mean, seriously, do we drag our bratty kids out to the town square and stone them to death? Because that's what God wishes. Why not ask the homosexuals in America if they think our nation is better due to the fact that uppity Christians got their way over gay marriage? You claim that "if even only 60% of the population" was adhering to God's wishes, well, what of the other 40%? How many millions does that leave to be oppressed and persecuted for NOT being a part of the other 60%? So yes, perhaps if you are a Christian, a world such as you describe will be all rainbows and rose gardens, but history shows that, for everyone else, the world will be a very dark place indeed.If we had even only 60% of the population adhering to Gods wishes, then we would have a better place to live in with better people in it.
No ... actually, it doesn't. You make it sound as if good dress and cleanliness are mutually exclusive; if you see someone wearing a t-shirt, then that person obviously hasn't showered in a week. Is that really true? Of course not. I can assure you that if I decide to throw on a pair of jeans and a t-shirt to go out, my hygiene is still impeccable.Good dress sense goes along with cleanliness.
And just what, exactly, IS "good dress?" That's going to be a contentious issue, especially among women. Will women have to wear dresses everywhere, even when impractical? I can't help but remember old news reel footage of Russian women digging trenches while wearing dresses ... it was so ludicrous! And will these dresses have to be shin-length? Ankle-length to keep us modest? Will we revert to having to wear dreadful corsets? LOL! I don't mean to pick on you, Mel, but everyone thinks their way is the best way, the right way, the moral way. I look at teens these days loading themselves up with piercings and think, "Damn, that looks disgusting." But hey, no one is forcing me to get one. All generations have taken issue with how the next generation dresses. It's just the natural reaction to change.
Of course it does, but again, I think you're confusing hygiene with fashion sense, and let me tell you, fashion is extremely expensive for women. Not only do female styles constantly go in and out of fashion on an almost daily basis (causing women to be in a perpetual state of blowing tons of money on rebuilding wardrobes), good women's clothing costs a fortune. If you're curious, just do a google search on dresses and marvel at how expensive they are. Not formal dresses mind you, but just a good stylish dress ... we're talking $120 or more. For one. If you're a good shopper, you can get a pair of jeans and a few t-shirts for $30. So you can see why fashion has "gone down hill" to some degree. In truth, I love getting all dressed up sometimes, and I agree, it can make you feel gooooood. Mmmhmm! But it can be a money pit for the female half of the species, and many of us simply don't have that kind of cash.To be seen clean rather than dirty surely matters to oneself and to others
Take care, Mel.
Shirina- Former Administrator
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
Looks like i'm wasting my time Shirina as we can agree on very little.
I suppose we here in the UK have become more and more Americanised over the years and I do not know if we have benefitted from that or not.
Now that you have given me some idea of how you see it in America and
I must say I am somewhat surprised as I had thought most American people were God loving and visited church much more so than we do here in the UK.
The black USA population seem to be even more religious than the white's, is that so?
It is intersesting to note your views on religion and especially God and indeed the alternative very pro God views of our American friend Rock, seeing as both of you are well educated.
Back to dress again Modesty has also gone out of the window. Men years ago would drool over the sight of a womans ankle, now nothing is hidden from view and femaninity has also diminished to a very low level.
Even the Suffragettes of long ago continued to wear dresses and were still adhering to moral standards in general. Why now after centuries of women dressing differently to men has it changed? And why in your opinion has the American lost his true meaning of Christianity, which has obviously spread to us here in the UK?
Nice to chat Shirina,
Get well and keep well.
I suppose we here in the UK have become more and more Americanised over the years and I do not know if we have benefitted from that or not.
Now that you have given me some idea of how you see it in America and
I must say I am somewhat surprised as I had thought most American people were God loving and visited church much more so than we do here in the UK.
The black USA population seem to be even more religious than the white's, is that so?
It is intersesting to note your views on religion and especially God and indeed the alternative very pro God views of our American friend Rock, seeing as both of you are well educated.
Back to dress again Modesty has also gone out of the window. Men years ago would drool over the sight of a womans ankle, now nothing is hidden from view and femaninity has also diminished to a very low level.
Even the Suffragettes of long ago continued to wear dresses and were still adhering to moral standards in general. Why now after centuries of women dressing differently to men has it changed? And why in your opinion has the American lost his true meaning of Christianity, which has obviously spread to us here in the UK?
Nice to chat Shirina,
Get well and keep well.
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
At last mel, you've found a thread that suits you
tlttf- Banned
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Re: Can God love? (Part 1)
I have my doubts over whether that many Americans are really all that "God loving." What I see more is that Americans love using religion to point blame-fingers at everyone else to make themselves feel superior. There's a lot of ego at work more so than religious fervor, and the power religion gives to sit in judgment of others is the true ambrosia of American Christianity. Our version of it was founded on Puritanical beliefs, mind, and the Puritans were some of the most hard-core sin-persecutors in the history of mankind. Unfortunately, some of that superstitious nonsense has survived into modern times so that, in some respects, we're like cavemen with lots of gadgets and the largest cache of nukes on the planet. Our technology has far outstripped our cultural and spiritual growth, and that is incredibly dangerous.I must say I am somewhat surprised as I had thought most American people were God loving and visited church much more so than we do here in the UK.
Don't get me wrong, there are still tens of millions of Christians who practice their faith quietly and unobtrusively ... those who follow Jesus and the New Testament rather than the ugly wrathful murderous creature described in the Old Testament. Unfortunately, those millions often stand aside and let the radical, militant evangelicals run the show. The end result is a a form of Christo-fascism rooted in a cherry-picked version of Christianity and the love of greed, power, and the soulless entity called a "corporation."
Women have been victimized by fashion for centuries. Women have had to wear horribly impractical and uncomfortable clothing for the sake of modesty for far too long. Meanwhile, men can run around in nothing but a pair of shorts while women would sweat under several layers of ankle-length clothing even on the hottest days. I'm not a fan of long dresses - they restrict movement, get tangled in the legs, and get caught on every little protrusion you walk past. I had to wear a floor-length hoop skirt for a wedding once, and I was so puffed out I couldn't even get through the door. Fortunately, the hoops were collapsible so I could sit down, but US Southern women - who had to wear these monstrosities as daily wear - had no such thing. They had to remain standing indefinitely because rigid hoops in the skirt would keep it from resting on your legs if the woman sat down. Instead, it would fly up, giving anyone a very clear view.Modesty has also gone out of the window. Men years ago would drool over the sight of a womans ankle
BUT ... having said that, I agree that SOME outfits are atrocious, some skirts are so short I wonder why the girl bothered to even put it on. Yet I am grateful that I do not live in a time when women were burdened by as many as 5 petticoats ... and having to drag all of that fabric around with every footstep, having your skirts get stepped on by people standing too close, the hem picking up all the dirt and dust on the floor, getting them caught in car doors, risking having your skirt pulled right off you if it gets caught on a nail or twig. Men don't understand, I think, the headaches that all caused.
Yet I stand in agreement with you about the decline of femininity. Unfortunately, our patriarchal society has brainwashed even the women that femininity is weak, and it still goes on today.
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» Evidence for the existence of God (Part 2)
» What now for Labour? (Part 1)
» Is there any validity for religious dogma to challenge scientific empiricism, and if so what proper evidence has religion for such an assertion?
» Evidence for the existence of God (Part 1)
» Evidence for the existence of God (Part 2)
» What now for Labour? (Part 1)
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