Evidence for the existence of God (Part 1)

by keenobserver1 Sat Oct 08, 2011 3:14 pm

First topic message reminder :

If there is a God, he definetly isn't English.

by snowyflake Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:56 pm

Anyway, I would like us to get back to Shirina's question. What is the benefit of faith. Why did it evolve and why do we need it?

by Guest Mon Feb 11, 2013 11:11 pm

snowyflake wrote:
All this might be true, Rock, but again it is down to interpretation.

I’m happy that you can see that “this might be true.” It’s actually down to exposition, particularly exposition within context, which is often absent in many folks’ procession from reading/listening to concluding.

There remains a fundamental difference between mandating that which is nonexistent prior to and at the time it is first mandated and diminishing the brutality through regulations of that which has been and is existent at the time it is first regulated.

Think of the difference between the UK and the US regarding gun ownership. In the UK, folks just casually accepted gun prohibition. Try gun prohibition in the US and it’s revolution time. New laws must fit the culture in order to be worth the paper upon which they’re scribbled; otherwise, they’re just so much chicken scratching on parchment. And remember, these portions of the Law (Torah) are not spiritual mandates; they’re statute laws for a new nation aborning. YHVH Elohim’s spiritual (and thus eternal) laws within Torah are quite often accompanied by such phrases as “I am the LORD your God”, words that are absent in the quotes you’ve provided and similar quotes in Torah.

snowyflake wrote:
To my uneducated eye, the bible is condoning slavery because it is giving rules and regulations on how to treat slaves. And how slaves should treat their owners. You would think that God would have told the Hebrews and Jews that owning other humans was wrong and would have forbidden it in the same way as lying, murdering and stealing. But God doesn't do that. Instead he makes a lot of rules around it.

You are not omniscient, and neither am I. Why did Omniscience do it that way? I can speculate, but no matter how logical my speculation might be, I still lack omniscience, and I still don’t know. With that cautionary note publicly stated, I will indeed speculate.

Had slavery been “poofed” away circa 1400 BC, slavery would not have remained “that evil institution” up to and through the 18th Century AD, and “Willie (Wilberforce) and ‘the boyz’” would not have gone down in history as an abiding reminder of the righteousness which humans can accomplish through persistent insistence unto death. In 2013, I often need to remember William Wilberforce, Sojourner Truth, Frederick Douglass, Harriet Tubman, the unnamed heroes who served as conductors for the Underground Railroad, and in modern times, Rosa Parks, Medgar Evers, Andrew Goodman, James Chaney, Michael Schwerner, El-Hajj Malik El-Shabazz, (Malcolm X), Martin Luther King, Jr., Nelson Mandela, and far too many other heroes to name in this short space, as I seek inspiration to continue fighting the little battles to bring about liberty and justice for all, one starfish at a time.

snowyflake wrote:
I can perfectly understand how people see the bible as condoning slavery.

Given rampant mis-teaching of Torah, so can I.

snowyflake wrote:
Anyway, I would like us to get back to Shirina's question. What is the benefit of faith. Why did it evolve and why do we need it?

Perhaps we need it to strengthen us when we are tempted to falter. Several decades ago, I was tempted to falter in opposing through personal action sending my brothers overseas to suffer and die in hell. I did not falter; I was scared as cold spit, but I did not falter. At the time, as a new Baha’i, I could have taken the easy way out. I did not; through faith I did not falter.

Multiply that tiny battle won by the millions who did not falter, and several years prior, J.L. Chestnut’s faith in America (USV) and mankind was restored (12:34-14:56). I invite you to hear his story as he told it by clicking his name above, or by clicking here.

by polyglide Tue Feb 12, 2013 3:09 pm

The reason we need faith is because without it there is little else.

Everyone with an enquiring mind at some time or other considers the reason for life along with the hows and wherefores.

The only logical conclusion is that there must be a reason and a purpose for all life and the fact that humans are so far removed in ability and everything else from all other life that their purpose must be different from all other life.

There are many theories none of which hold water, so we are left with the discredited evolution theory or the creation fact, the latter does need faith and that is why we need it.

by snowyflake Tue Feb 12, 2013 6:10 pm

The reason we need faith is because without it there is little else.

I don't need faith. I'd rather have my reason and view the world in a rational light.

We all must find our own purpose in life. If you think God gives you a purpose then I would be interested to know what purpose in life has God given you? My purpose in life doesn't involve faith. The reason we are here is explained quite well by science although I accept there are many unanswered questions that science needs to answer. Philisophical questions that you raise are part of our human condition but looking for answers in a supreme being is, to me, psychologically damaging. It's delusional in the extreme and no different to a child's belief in Santa Claus.

Evolution is only discredited by delusional Christian pseudo-scientists for whom you have a penchant and faith. No evidence, just faith. As much good as it does you.

by willingsniper Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:09 pm

Why faith? It's absolutely empty without action. I wish, I hope, I pray... All useless without action.
And waiting for a nonexistent entity to take action is ridiculous. What a waste of time.

by oftenwrong Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:39 pm

Blessed are the God-botherers; for they out-number the rest of us.

by snowyflake Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:40 pm

Blessed are the cheesemakers...

by willingsniper Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:41 pm

Indeed blessed are the cheese makers

by snowyflake Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:43 pm

Hello Sniper Smile

How are you? I popped into your site today. It looks great. Smile

by willingsniper Tue Feb 12, 2013 7:51 pm

Hi honey I saw that. I don't wish to promote here though. I hope you understand

by snowyflake Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:14 pm

No problem Smile

Nice to see you here. Take care.

by oftenwrong Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:24 pm

snowyflake wrote:Blessed are the cheesemakers...

especially the firm called "Cheeses of Nazareth"

by willingsniper Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:40 pm

I like that cheese' crust. It does seem to come back up though.

by oftenwrong Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:58 pm

The moral of which would seem to be, "Chew every mouthful several times before swallowing."

by Guest Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:27 am

snowyflake wrote:
Blessed are the cheesemakers..

Serious stuff first. Did you listen to J.L. Chestnut’s account? “There except by the grace of my mother and father go I.” I was old enough to be there (Selma, Alabama), I had saved up my train fare and room & board money, and I had both given myself permission and purposed myself to go as soon as the spring semester ended and summer had begun. Unfortunately, I wasn’t old enough to override my parent’s two vetoes, so perhaps I dodged death whilst being stuck and frustrated.

Now to even more serious stuff. You left out some key words, which I have courteously provided, as rewritten below:

Blessed are the Philly cheesesteak makers.
Blessed are the Tommy’s chili-cheeseburger makers.

Haven’t had a Tommy’s chili-cheeseburger for a year. Haven’t had a Philly cheesesteak in Philly for decades. Ah, the memories…

by oftenwrong Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:24 am

Ah, the Rennies....

by bobby Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:39 am

ow, Cheeses of Nazareth can now be found in Julius Caesars favourite shop, Marcus and Spencius.

by polyglide Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:42 am

Neigh lads and lasses , you should try a horse burger, dressed as a beef burger and bray that you don't suffer ill feelings.

To a more sensible consideration.

Creation is a fact of life, everything must have been created, nothing can come about by chance.

Even were there to be anti matter it still means that everything must have been created, by one means or another you cannot have anything that has not been created.

If you believe in evolution you still have to say where the material involved originated and it must have been created by some means or another.

You cannot have something evolving from nothing.

The natural selection theory is as daft as you can get.

Where are the elephants with three trunks and three legs and others with nine trunks and fourteen legs and all those in between from which the
existing elephants decided they wanted to adopt.

There are numerous such examples that make the theory laughable to any sane person.

Where did the 45 ton dinosaurs come from?.

The only rationnal explanation is instant creation and therefore a creator.

by snowyflake Wed Feb 13, 2013 10:02 pm

Hi Rock. That was a very moving account by JL Chestnut. When I hear stories from people like him, I'm almost always convinced they would be this way with or without belief in God. America is a Christian nation. It's so Christian they try to make laws surrounding Christian belief. It's no wonder that a good proportion of the population believe in a supreme being.

He sounds like he was a very good man. And my faith in human nature tells me that very good men are very good men with or without their belief in God.

Like you, Rock. You have principles and I thoroughly believe that even if you were an atheist, you would not give up on your principles...because that's just the kind of man you are.

Take care of you and yours. Life in the UK is a bit rough at the moment but it will get better. ttys

by polyglide Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:06 pm

The only way life will get better is if people stop being selfish and do away with the I am alright Jack attitude.

I bet when you go to a nice warm bed you do not give a hoot for those who are out on the streets and copuld not care less and that is the reason the world is in such a state.

If you are up to date with the situation you will know that there are thousands of children undernourished and thousands of old people having to choose between heat and eat and that is in the UK, heaven alone knows the situation in the third world and all you do is be self satisfied.

Some state to be in.

by snowyflake Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:27 pm

The only way life will get better is if people stop being selfish and do away with the I am alright Jack attitude.

No truer word was spoken by the holier than thou....

I bet when you go to a nice warm bed

Yes, I'm very lucky due to my geography and the geography of my birth. I had a fairly good education compared to some. My parents had jobs, I have a job, my husband has a job. We do alright.

you do not give a hoot for those who are out on the streets and copuld not care less

How would you know? You have never asked me this question. You don't know me in real life. You don't know what I do. Making unfounded statements about online contributors to this thread makes you look a doofus. Back up your assertion or don't make it in the first place. It's rude.

and that is the reason the world is in such a state.

Because I go to sleep in a warm bed at night and you assume (wrongly) that I don't care about the poor and the downtroddern therefore the world is in the state it's in.

Wow, talk about a non sequitor argument.

May I ask what you do to care for the poor, polyglide?

by Shirina Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:35 pm

I bet when you go to a nice warm bed you do not give a hoot for those who are out on the streets and copuld not care less and that is the reason the world is in such a state.

The irony here is that, in America, the blowhard Christians are the FIRST people to whine very loudly about how their taxes are being spent on the poor, elderly, and disabled. Those who pound their chests the loudest about their superior Christian morality are the same people ranting and raving about poor single moms with cellphones, who believe that people on benefits shouldn't be allowed to vote, who give poor people dirty looks in the grocery line when they pull out their EBT cards, who have convinced themselves that everyone on welfare is lazy and everyone on disability is faking it. Yeah, why should THEY have to pay for someone else's health care? Someone else's food? Someone else's roof?

They're the ones who insist that anyone on welfare should live as close to third world poverty as humanly possible without actually dying of starvation. They're the ones who believe that people on welfare should have no fun, no entertainment, no diversion from the harsh realities of poverty. They're the ones who think charity is the only answer so that they can control and micromanage the lives of the poor. It makes these Christians feel good that they gave someone a blanket or ladeled out some soup at a homeless shelter - but spit and hiss about paying taxes so that the poor aren't homeless or lining up for hours at a soup kitchen.

An overwhelming number of so-called Christians worship Mammon in the guise of Christ, the almighty $ as their religious symbol.

by oftenwrong Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:14 pm

An impressive but unadvertised number of people provide a direct service to the needy by their voluntary work manning mobile soup-kitchens and clothing distribution centres. They are notable for their disinclination to receive Publicity for what they do.

The ones we hear about are mainly the people who want us to hear about them. My contribution is to put the clothes I can't get into any more inside a plasy bag left at the gate when invited to do so by the Sally Army.

by polyglide Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:35 pm

The fact that some people who say they are Christians do not act like Christians proves nothing other than they are not Christians, it is like saying all MPs are theives liars and perverts just because some are.
In every walk of life you get pretenders.

by Guest Thu Feb 21, 2013 12:53 am

Shirina wrote:
Shirinaon Tue 19 Feb 2013 - 18:35
https://cuttingedge2.forumotion.co.uk/t4p960-evidence-for-the-existence-of-god#34560

The irony here is that, in America… Christians…

Here’s who Christians are, in America, and in every place that Christians are:

Greek Bible

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who persecute and insult you, that so you may be true sons of your Father in heaven, who makes his sun rise equally on the evil and on the good, his rain fall equally on the just and on the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? If you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.”

Matthew 5:43-48

Greek Bible

“Therefore, in all things whatsoever, treat people the same way you want them to treat you, for this is the Law and the Prophets.”

Matthew 7:12

Greek Bible

Then one of them, that was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, saying, “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?”

And Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

But wishing to justify himself, the lawyer said to Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

And Jesus answering said, “A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among robbers, and they stripped him and beat him, and departed, leaving him half dead. And by chance a certain priest came down that road, and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side. And likewise a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side.”

“But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came upon him, and when he saw him, he felt compassion for him, and came to him and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him.”

“And on the next day when he departed, he took out two denarii, and gave them to the innkeeper and said unto him, ‘Take care of him, and whatsoever more you spend, when I return I will repay you.’”

“Which of these three do you think was neighbor to the man that fell among the robbers?” And the lawyer said, “The one who showed mercy toward him.”

Then Jesus said to him, “Go, and do likewise.”

Matthew 22:35-40, Luke 10:29-37

Greek Bible:

“But when the son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. All the nations will be gathered before him; and he will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, and he will put the sheep on his right, and the goats on the left.”

“Then the king will say to those on his right, ‘come, you who are blessed of my father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was hungry, and you gave me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited me in; naked, and you clothed me; I was sick, and you visited me; I was in prison, and you came to me.’ then the righteous will answer him, ‘lord, when did we see you hungry, and feed you, or thirsty, and give you something to drink? And when did we see you a stranger, and invite you in, or naked, and clothe you? When did we see you sick, or in prison, and come to you?’ the king will answer and say to them, ‘truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of mine, even the least of them, you did it to me.’”

“Then he will also say to those on his left, ‘ depart from me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry, and you gave me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me nothing to drink; I was a stranger, and you did not invite me in; naked, and you did not clothe me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit me.’ then they themselves also will answer, ‘lord, when did we see you hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not [a]take care of you?’ then he will answer them, ‘truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’”

Matthew 25:31-45

Christians are those who, to the best of their abilities, of their own free will, heed the words of Christ, mold themselves to be like Christ, and treat others as Christ teaches that others ought to be treated.

Shirina wrote:
… whine very loudly about how their taxes are being spent on the poor, elderly, and disabled.

… pound their chests the loudest about their superior Christian morality…

… ranting and raving about poor single moms with cellphones…

… believe that people on benefits shouldn't be allowed to vote…

… give poor people dirty looks in the grocery line when they pull out their EBT cards…

… have convinced themselves that everyone on welfare is lazy and everyone on disability is faking it.

… insist that anyone on welfare should live as close to third world poverty as humanly possible without actually dying of starvation.

… believe that people on welfare should have no fun, no entertainment, no diversion from the harsh realities of poverty.

… think charity is the only answer so that they can control and micromanage the lives of the poor.

… spit and hiss about paying taxes so that the poor aren't homeless or lining up for hours at a soup kitchen.

You’re not describing Christians. Perhaps you can identify who you’re describing.

by snowyflake Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:05 am

I suppose the same can be said for muslims who blow things up in the name of Allah?

Sorry but I'm not buying this. If you claim to be affiliated with a religion and do things in the name of your God who has the right to say that you are not of that religion or belief? This is where belief baffles me. Fred Phelps is as much a Christian as anyone else saying they are Christian. The qu'ran burning minister in Florida thinks he is doing God's work. The abortion clinic bombers and doctor killers think they are acting in the name of Jesus.

To disown association with other Christians because you don't like what they do is the same as muslims disowning those devout muslims who flew into the Twin Towers.

It doesn't work and it doesn't solve anything.

by bobby Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:36 am

What's all this Greek Bible crap, a Greek Bible would be writen in bloody Greek wouldn't it, so what Rockonbrother had wtitten is no more than just another translation/imterpritation.

by snowyflake Thu Feb 21, 2013 10:37 am

Crikey bobby Smile

it's 'interpretation'. You got fat fingers this morning? Smile

by Guest Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:50 am

snowyflake wrote:
I suppose the same can be said for muslims who blow things up in the name of Allah?

Muslims follow teachings found in the Hebrew Bible, the Greek Bible, and the Qur’an, including the entirety of Jesus’ teachings on the mount, documented in the Book of Mathew, commonly called the Sermon on the Mount, wherein Jesus teaches that treating others as you desire others to treat you is the Law and the Prophets. Muslims are taught, from the Qur’an, to treat Jews, “People of the Law”, and Christians, “People of the Gospel”, collectively “People of the Book” with dignity, honor, respect, and deference.

The terrorists/murderers/genocidists of whom you speak are not Muslims.

My friend, who taught anyone sensible and smart enough to be taught exactly what the Qur’an teaches about Muslims’ treatment of “People of the Book”, was executed in his native Pakistan by non-Muslims posing as Muslims for so teaching.

snowyflake wrote:
Sorry but I'm not buying this.

I’m not selling “this”; I’m expositing truth. Truth is never bought, truth is never sold. Truth, once presented, is either accepted or rejected; thus, since truth has been presented herein, you can either accept or reject truth.

snowyflake wrote:
If you claim to be affiliated with a religion and do things in the name of your God who has the right to say that you are not of that religion or belief?

I do. I have done so three times below, and I shall do so whenever the opportunity to do so arises.

snowyflake wrote:
This is where belief baffles me.

I know. Scammers such as those you’ve identified below seek to baffle as many people as they can so that their scams can go undetected.

snowyflake wrote:
Fred Phelps is as much a Christian as anyone else saying they are Christian.

Jesus does not teach what Fred Phelps says or does. Christians follow Jesus’ teachings in word and deed. Fred Phelps tramples and spits upon Jesus’ name (character) in word and in deed. Fred Phelps may be a “Phelps-ian”, but he is not a Christian. Fred Phelps is, however, a terrorist.

snowyflake wrote:
The qu'ran burning minister in Florida thinks he is doing God's work.

The Qur’an burning charlatan in Florida tramples and spits upon Jesus’ name (character) in word and in deed. He is not a Christian.

snowyflake wrote:
The abortion clinic bombers and doctor killers think they are acting in the name of Jesus.

The abortion clinic bombers/murderers trample and spit upon Jesus’ name (character) in word and in deed. They are not Christians. They are, however, terrorists.

snowyflake wrote:
To disown association with other Christians because you don't like what they do is the same as muslims disowning those devout muslims who flew into the Twin Towers.

Three errors in your statement:

I do not “disown association with other Christians” that terrorize funeral attendees, burn Qur’ans, and murder and terrorize people at abortion clinics. The persons you’ve identified, persons who trample and spit upon Jesus’ name (character) in word and in deed, are not Christians; they are vile, immoral individuals that I have never owned.
I do not despise these immoral individuals because I do not like what they do; I despise these immoral individuals because they trample and spit upon Jesus’ name (character) in word and in deed.
The immoral individuals identified by you that are disowned by Muslims are not “devout muslims”; they are murderers/terrorists/genocidists that trample and spit upon the Qur’an’s teachings.

snowyflake wrote:
It doesn't work…

Expositing, speaking, and writing truth always works.

snowyflake wrote:
… and it doesn't solve anything.

Expositing, speaking, and writing truth is neither intended nor designed to solve anything. It is the task of people who hear and understand truth to do that which solves things. Since I understand this exposited, spoken, and written truth, to the best of my ability I will correct the broadly believed misconception that immoral individuals who claim to be Jesus’ followers while trampling and spitting upon Jesus’ name (character) in word and deed are not Christians just because they lie and say that they are Christians.

Once again, here’s who Christians are:

Greek Bible

“You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I say to you, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who persecute and insult you…”

Matthew 5:43-48, partial

Greek Bible

“Therefore, in all things whatsoever, treat people the same way you want them to treat you, for this is the Law and the Prophets.”

Matthew 7:12

Greek Bible

And Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

But wishing to justify himself, the lawyer said to Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?”

And Jesus answering said, “A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among robbers, and they stripped him and beat him, and departed, leaving him half dead. And by chance a certain priest came down that road, and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side. And likewise a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side.”

“But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came upon him, and when he saw him, he felt compassion for him, and came to him and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him.”

“And on the next day when he departed, he took out two denarii, and gave them to the innkeeper and said unto him, ‘Take care of him, and whatsoever more you spend, when I return I will repay you.’”

Matthew 22:35-40, Luke 10:29-37, partial

Greek Bible:

“Then the king will say to those on his right, ‘come, you who are blessed of my father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. For I was hungry, and you gave me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited me in; naked, and you clothed me; I was sick, and you visited me; I was in prison, and you came to me.’ then the righteous will answer him, ‘lord, when did we see you hungry, and feed you, or thirsty, and give you something to drink? And when did we see you a stranger, and invite you in, or naked, and clothe you? When did we see you sick, or in prison, and come to you?’ the king will answer and say to them, ‘truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of mine, even the least of them, you did it to me.’”

Matthew 25:31-45, partial

Jesus teaches; Christians, of their own free will, follow Jesus’ teachings.

by snowyflake Thu Feb 21, 2013 1:56 pm

I’m not selling “this”; I’m expositing truth. Truth is never bought, truth is never sold. Truth, once presented, is either accepted or rejected; thus, since truth has been presented herein, you can either accept or reject truth.

You don't know it's truth, Rock. You think it is, you believe it is. Doesn't mean it is. And the evidence is flimsy at best. And all this proves is that you believe your mythology is better than others.

The bottom line is we don't need all this foolishness. It's people arguing, debating, fighting and killing about who's got the Bigger, Better and New Improved God.

Like I said. It doesn't work. It's never worked and it won't work in the future. The rise of atheism shows that people are coming to their senses and thinking for themselves.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fY0oPg1h8fQ

Hey Rock, listen to this kid from Nottingham who is going to be the next big thing in Britain. Check him out. We saw him live in Norwich before he went on the Brit Awards. But I think he's going to be something special. Take care of yourself. Smile

by Guest Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:40 pm

snowyflake wrote:
I’m not selling “this”; I’m expositing truth. Truth is never bought, truth is never sold. Truth, once presented, is either accepted or rejected; thus, since truth has been presented herein, you can either accept or reject truth.
You don't know it's truth, Rock. You think it is, you believe it is. Doesn't mean it is. And the evidence is flimsy at best.

I know that it’s truth in four ways, three of which I can easily prove to you.

I know the truth of Jesus personally. I can neither prove this to you nor would I ever attempt to prove this to you.
I know that both the Hebrew Bible and Greek Bible exist. This I can prove to you by having a combined copy sent to you. Let me know (a) where to send it (the combined Bible), and (2) which translation you prefer, if indeed you prefer a translation rather than an original languages version.
I know that Jesus’ teachings are recorded in the Greek Bible. This I can prove to you by referring you to the Books of Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John in the Greek Bible portion of the combined Bible which I will have sent to you.
I know that the specific teachings of Jesus which I’ve referenced in this series of posts are recorded in the Book of Matthew in the Greek Bible. This I can prove to you by referring you to those specific teachings in the Book of Mathew in the Greek Bible portion of the combined Bible which I will have sent to you.

Also, if you wish proof of the truth that Christians are those that heed Jesus’ teachings, I can refer you to other portions of the Greek Bible in which that truth is confirmed.

snowyflake wrote:
And all this proves is that you believe your mythology is better than others.

I neither believe in a mythology (mine or anyone else’s) nor believe that that in which I do not believe is better than that in which others’ believe.

snowyflake wrote:
Like I said. It doesn't work. It's never worked and it won't work in the future. The rise of atheism shows that people are coming to their senses and thinking for themselves.

The rise of atheism shows that folks who so choose will believe anything that defies logic as long as the word “God” is not mentioned.

snowyflake wrote:
Hey Rock, listen to this kid from Nottingham who is going to be the next big thing in Britain. Check him out. We saw him live in Norwich before he went on the Brit Awards. But I think he's going to be something special. Take care of yourself.

I’ll check him out, my friend.

Not bad. You might like this full screen version.

Jake Bugg - Lightning Bolt - Official Video
http://youtube.googleapis.com/v/fY0oPg1h8fQ

by Shirina Thu Feb 21, 2013 3:08 pm

I know that both the Hebrew Bible and Greek Bible exist.

"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad." - George Bernard Shaw.

Not to suggest that you're a madman, Rock, but it does illustrate the dangers of believing something simply because someone wrote it down.

I just read this piece that claimed to have proof that two (of the three) great pyramids on the Giza plateau are actually the breasts of a giant female statue buried beneath the sand. Hmm ... should I believe it? Perhaps if this ridiculous theory had a charismatic supporter, millions of people would buy into it.

One in five Americans believe witches are real, that the sun revolves around the earth, and that the Apocalypse will happen in their lifetimes.

30% of Americans still believe that Saddam Hussein had something to do with 9/11, 20% believe Obama isn't an American citizen, 30% believe we did not, or have doubts about, America's moon landing, 20% of Texans believe Obama is a Muslim, 37% of Americans believe Sarah Palin is qualified to be president, 25% believe in Astrology, and the list goes on.

All of them believe their beliefs are "The Truth."

Humans are easily fooled.

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Re: Evidence for the existence of God (Part 1)

Re: Evidence for the existence of God (Part 1)

Re: Evidence for the existence of God (Part 1)