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Where should the Labour Party position itself? (Part 1)

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Post by blueturando Tue Jan 17, 2012 5:10 pm

First topic message reminder :

Do Labour go hunting for the electorate who voted Blair into power 3 times and risk the wrath of the Unions, or side with the core Labour party supporters and the Unions at a risk of being unable to get back the voters who deserted them in the last election?
 
The scale of the rift between Labour and the unions over Ed Miliband's decision to embrace austerity measures has been made clear as a senior leader warned of long-term implications over the "most serious mistake" the party could have made.
Unions affiliated to Labour have been fuming since shadow chancellor Ed Balls told a conference at the weekend that he would not reverse the Government's planned 1% public sector pay cap, which affects millions of workers.
Unite leader Len McCluskey warned that Mr Miliband was setting Labour on course for electoral "disaster" and undermining his own leadership by accepting Government cuts and the cap on public sector pay.
Mr Miliband hit back against his union critics, insisting that Mr McCluskey was "wrong" to attack his decision to embrace austerity measures.
It has emerged that the leader of the GMB has written to the union's senior officials saying that the speech by Ed Balls may have a "profound impact" on its relationship with the Labour Party.
General secretary Paul Kenny said in the message: "I have spoken to Ed Milliband and Ed Balls to ensure they were aware of how wrong I think the policy they are now following is. It is now time for careful consideration and thought before the wider discussions begin on the long-term implications this new stance by the party has on GMB affiliation.
"It will be a fundamental requirement that the CEC (executive) and Congress determine our way forward after proper debate. I will update everyone as events unfold but I have to say this is the most serious mistake they could have made and the Tories must be rubbing their hands with glee." The GMB declined to comment on the message but confirmed it had been sent.
Mr McCluskey said in an article in The Guardian: "Ed Balls' sudden weekend embrace of austerity and the Government's public sector pay squeeze represents a victory for discredited Blairism at the expense of the party's core supporters. It also challenges the whole course Ed Miliband has set for the party, and perhaps his leadership itself."
Mr Miliband responded in a statement: "Len McCluskey is entitled to his views but he is wrong. I am changing the Labour Party so we can deliver fairness even when there is less money around and that requires tough decisions."

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Post by Redflag Tue Mar 20, 2012 5:26 pm

tlttf wrote:Re: What needs to happen in Britain under Ed Miliband - but will it?

Ah wishful thinking in the extreme, when your told to think outside of the box I'm sure they don't mean out of your mind as well.

Yes it will thanks to the Tories and the L/Ds, after Aprils cuts to family tax credits and when the full force of there privatization of the NHS yes it will happen and not without the Tories MPs suffering at the hands of the people that voted them in at the last G.E.

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Post by oftenwrong Tue Mar 20, 2012 7:27 pm

astra wrote:Premium Bonds OW, don't forget the Premium Bonds!!


OH my rhumatics!!

mmmm yeah! £25 from Ernie to do whatever you like with! Drinks are on Vauxhall.
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Post by astra Tue Mar 20, 2012 7:53 pm

Just had a thort!! (OUCH)

Prior to the War (WW2) you did not get paid for holidays

Gideon could say we are NOT going to pay you while you are on holiday for 2 weeks! BUT we will put £20.00 of your weekly wages aside for you for your holidays (= £2,000 in your holiday fund) This will sit nicely next to the Pension Fund.

This can be used by the employers for their MORE deserving breaks wherever chosen, as the workers don't work half hard enuff (skooze me I'm starting to feel chest pains from laughing!) and ALL employers can do a little Maxwell EVERY year!


WOTTA WHEEZE!!
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Post by Redflag Wed Mar 21, 2012 7:56 am

astra wrote:
Trying to find and salvage wot the torys have not yet got round to selling off
!


ROADS TODAY


What tommorrow!


There is not much left for Scam..er..on to sell the NHS has gone the roads, Gove trying to privatize the Education system I think the only thing left is US.
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Post by trevorw2539 Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:25 am

RedFlag. quote

There is not much left for Scam..er..on to sell the NHS has gone the roads, Gove trying to privatize the Education system I think the only thing left is US.

The Feudal system was on the last Cabinet Agenda. A committee was set up to consider it.Laughing
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Post by astra Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:53 am

Feudal System??


No more allotments then,


Back to Runrig!

Spose it comes round, sold as improvements.
They'll be putting conductors on buses next and claiming THAT to be an original idea!!
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Post by trevorw2539 Wed Mar 21, 2012 12:58 pm

Astra Quote

No more allotments then,


That's a sore point round here. A landowner has just closed, by refusing to renew contract, a long term allotment plot. Beside being told he will not get permission he intends to keep applying for building permission.

No more potato plots - just building plots:( and I can tell you bricks do not have the same taste as Maris Piper potatoes;)
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Post by astra Wed Mar 21, 2012 1:58 pm

Trevor, Go to your local MP!

Allotments come under the same laws as Pigeon crees.

If there ARE pigeons on the land, the owner is stuffed (could even get "Queer Deany" involved (apologies to Rev. Spooner!) Smile
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Post by Redflag Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:13 pm

astra wrote:Trevor, Go to your local MP!

Allotments come under the same laws as Pigeon crees.

If there ARE pigeons on the land, the owner is stuffed (could even get "Queer Deany" involved (apologies to Rev. Spooner!) Smile

If his/her MP is Labour yell and scream at him/her if on the other hand the MP is Tory STAMP ON HIS HEAD.
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Post by blueturando Wed Mar 21, 2012 2:48 pm

Advocating violence Redflag.....Is this in the forum rules? I will have to ask Ivan as he is a stickler for the rules

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Post by bobby Wed Mar 21, 2012 3:08 pm

Putting the boot in to a Tory arsehole isn't violence, its justice, isnt that what they are doing to those who are worst off in Britain more violent. Well I know the answer so you dont need to respond, You are a Tory, we know that as you keep telling us, as though we didnt know anyway. You support them so it follows you must agree with them. They now have phucked up the Water, Electricity, Gas, Public transport and now are about to privatise the NHS and sell off our roads. There really isnt much left is there blueturando. But you carry on telling Redflag she is being violent, but this Tory led Govenment has turned violence into a phucking science, the only difference is they wouldnt have the guts to stand directly in fron of their victims.
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Post by astra Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:08 pm

on the other hand the MP is Tory STAMP ON HIS HEAD.


RED

It's a well known fact that "Where there is no sence, there is no feeling" cheers
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Post by blueturando Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:21 pm

It's a well known fact that "Where there is no sence, there is no feeling

Lol....That hurt my feelings Wink

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Post by Ivanhoe Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:24 pm

blueturando wrote:
It's a well known fact that "Where there is no sence, there is no feeling

Lol....That hurt my feelings Wink

Tory supporters are without feelings.
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Post by blueturando Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:29 pm

I can prove otherwise

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Post by Ivanhoe Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:32 pm

blueturando wrote:I can prove otherwise

No you cant. Tory supporters are soulless, and I mean that.
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Post by Redflag Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:44 pm

Ivanhoe wrote:
blueturando wrote:I can prove otherwise

No you cant. Tory supporters are soulless, and I mean that.

A right shower of Unfeeling Uncaring Soulless BACKSTUDS Ivanhoe and today has proved us lefties to be right about this Gov't.
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Post by Ivanhoe Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:29 pm

Redflag wrote:
Ivanhoe wrote:
blueturando wrote:I can prove otherwise

No you cant. Tory supporters are soulless, and I mean that.

A right shower of Unfeeling Uncaring Soulless BACKSTUDS Ivanhoe and today has proved us lefties to be right about this Gov't.

Ge4ortge Osborne gave £5,000 a year State pensioners, a £5.35p State pension increase from April, and he reduced taxes for the rich, by 5 per cent.

I take it Bluey supports this crap ?
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Post by astra Thu Mar 22, 2012 1:01 am

Blue, ever thought that the boys in Downing Street are going too far?

You may be losing intrest in their methods. I did in 1980!

Government in this country is cr4p! But how do we effect change in procedures?
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Post by trevorw2539 Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:50 am

Quote Ivanhoe

Ge4ortge Osborne gave £5,000 a year State pensioners, a £5.35p State pension increase from April, and he reduced taxes for the rich, by 5 per cent.


Osborne gave us nothing. This was due to us anyway under the system. Rate of inflation of the previous September. This was 5.2%. If it had been 3% that is what we would have 'got' - received.

Thanks for nothing Ossie.

What. No 2 fingered emoticon.Wink Not even Churchill style:oops:


Last edited by trevorw2539 on Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:53 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Emphasis)
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Post by Ivanhoe Thu Mar 22, 2012 12:53 pm

trevorw2539 wrote:Quote Ivanhoe

Ge4ortge Osborne gave £5,000 a year State pensioners, a £5.35p State pension increase from April, and he reduced taxes for the rich, by 5 per cent.


Osborne gave us nothing. This was due to us anyway under the system. Rate of inflation of the previous September. This was 5.2%. If it had been 3% that is what we would have 'got' - received.

Thanks for nothing Ossie.

What. No 2 fingered emoticon.Wink Not even Churchill style:oops:

Trevor, I know all that. I was just stating what he had done. If you read an earlier message on this to Bluey, you will note I used the word "crap".
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Post by trevorw2539 Thu Mar 22, 2012 1:21 pm

IVANHOE qUOTE.

Trevor, I know all that. I was just stating what he had done. If you read an earlier message on this to Bluey, you will note I used the word "crap".

Sorry I misinterpreted your post.

I had already posted similar on another thread when tlttf posted about Osborne 'giving' pensioners the £5.35.

As you know pensioners got nothing but grief from this budget.

My only question is simply this. Next year the pension for 'new' pensioners will be £140 flat rate. Currently the Government say a pensioner should exist on a total of £130 pw. However, it is still possible to get more by means tested benefits. Council Tax relief, Council housing rent assistance. Heating allowance, not means tested.

When the standard rate of £140 comes into effect will these other benefits be available for the new pensioners.

Without them no pensioner on the government pension will be able to exist.

I'm just waiting for the government to cancel many of these, if they haven't decided, or have it in mind, already.

I don't want to live in luxury like these rich folk. I just want to live. ERM

Maybe I do want to live like them. Very Happy


Last edited by trevorw2539 on Thu Mar 22, 2012 1:24 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : to correct initials)
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Post by Ivanhoe Thu Mar 22, 2012 2:54 pm

trevorw2539 wrote:IVANHOE qUOTE.

Trevor, I know all that. I was just stating what he had done. If you read an earlier message on this to Bluey, you will note I used the word "crap".

Sorry I misinterpreted your post.

I had already posted similar on another thread when tlttf posted about Osborne 'giving' pensioners the £5.35.

As you know pensioners got nothing but grief from this budget.

My only question is simply this. Next year the pension for 'new' pensioners will be £140 flat rate. Currently the Government say a pensioner should exist on a total of £130 pw. However, it is still possible to get more by means tested benefits. Council Tax relief, Council housing rent assistance. Heating allowance, not means tested.

When the standard rate of £140 comes into effect will these other benefits be available for the new pensioners.

Without them no pensioner on the government pension will be able to exist.

I'm just waiting for the government to cancel many of these, if they haven't decided, or have it in mind, already.

I don't want to live in luxury like these rich folk. I just want to live. ERM

Maybe I do want to live like them. Very Happy

Your apology is accepted Trevor. I dont know any of the answers to your questions. All I know is that Osborne has delivered a typical right wing Tory Budget that looks after the rich very nicely.

Im also wondering , just how many of the richer pensioners Osborne has hit, are Tory supporters ?
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Post by trevorw2539 Thu Mar 22, 2012 4:36 pm

Quote Ivanhoe

Im also wondering , just how many of the richer pensioners Osborne has hit, are Tory supporters ?

Some at least from what I heard on local regional TV last night. And they're not best pleased!
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Post by Scarecrow Thu Mar 22, 2012 4:57 pm

The tories know damn well they will not be returned to government at the next election , therefore they have free reign to do there best to get all there private corporate chums into the fold , under the guise of re-building Britain. The economic downturn is being used as a proxy to bring in more and more private consortiums, telling the British public this is good for the countries infrastructure.
They are still the TOXIC TORIES of old , and the people just sleepwalk day after day, accepting the BS that this coalition dishes out.

Where should the Labour Party position itself? (Part 1) - Page 6 Dave
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Post by Redflag Thu Mar 22, 2012 6:42 pm

Ivanhoe wrote:
Redflag wrote:
Ivanhoe wrote:
blueturando wrote:I can prove otherwise

No you cant. Tory supporters are soulless, and I mean that.

A right shower of Unfeeling Uncaring Soulless BACKSTUDS Ivanhoe and today has proved us lefties to be right about this Gov't.

Ge4ortge Osborne gave £5,000 a year State pensioners, a £5.35p State pension increase from April, and he reduced taxes for the rich, by 5 per cent.

I take it Bluey supports this crap ?

And what there not telling us that an increase in the state pension will be TAKEN OFF there pension credits and I know this because I get both and have been told by the DWP that what I gain on the state pension I will loose all but a £1.00 off my pension credits, the devil is in the detail just like yesterdays budget.
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Post by oftenwrong Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:33 pm

Why is anybody surprised? We knew in 1997 that the Tories were only interested in themselves.

The Message for Ed Miliband is, "Everything comes to he who waits."

Not long now. The Local Elections in May will stir everybody up.
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Post by Phil Hornby Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:47 pm

One can only imagine the shame in having to troop door-to-door canvassing votes and declaring to good folk that one is a Tory candidate.

It must surely be easier to admit to simultaneously being a convicted paedophile and benefit cheat of long-standing , while having a surreptitious jerry can of petrol in one's downstairs lavatory...
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Post by oftenwrong Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:20 pm

Can there be a single Tory MP tonight who doesn't think that things are not quite going their way?
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Post by LWS Fri Mar 30, 2012 8:31 am

Well after Galloway's win in Bradford, I think Labour should have to have another look at the way it does things.

The saving grace is at least the Tory and Lib Dem dross came in 3rd & 4th where they belong!
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Post by tlttf Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:28 am

If Milli reverses the vat on hot pasties at least Prescot will vote for him. :bom:

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Post by betty.noire Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:35 am

tlttf wrote:If Milli reverses the vat on hot pasties at least Prescot will vote for him. :bom:

that obese fat eff wants boiling down for glue, for all the use he is
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Post by Mel Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:38 am

Pickles anyone??
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Post by betty.noire Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:40 am

why has my word been edited to "eff" ?
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Post by betty.noire Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:42 am

I thought their rules were set up to protect people from abuse not to define the everyday language of millions of people as 'bad'.

Poor old Philip Larkin would never have got on well with discussion boards
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Post by betty.noire Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:44 am

im not happy my words have been edited, can someone delete my account please ?

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Post by tlttf Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:48 am

Welcome to the board where all things left are true (even if taken from the beano) and anything else is edited to appease the sensitive souls that abound here. Or as the famous quote goes.
"there are 2 truths. The universe is infinite and the labour party tells no lies". I'm not sure about the universe bit though. Razz

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Post by astradt1 Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:23 am

Betty what a shame you have to be so clear in your use of swear words...sticking fullstops in does not really change the word......

I'm sure we are all adult and bright enough to be able to get the jist if the letters were rearranged a little....

Remember we have to abide by the site providers rules........

Please reword your post....
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Post by betty.noire Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:25 am

I was making a point

what part of "I thought their rules were set up to protect people from abuse not to define the everyday language of millions of people as 'bad'. "

dont you understand ?
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Post by astradt1 Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:38 am

Betty can you imagine what first time visitors are likely to think if they see blatant swear words......

If you notice I did not say you should not use the words, but that you could have been a little more subtle about it.......

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Post by oftenwrong Fri Mar 30, 2012 12:52 pm

Heavens, this takes me back to a saying of my Grandmother's ....

Only strike a child with a killing blow, and only swear if you can't win the argument.
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