Is the Tory Party an anachronism which should be disbanded?

First topic message reminder :

“No one ever rode to power on such a husky sledge of blatant untruth as David Cameron – greenest, most family-friendly, kindest to poor and disabled children and no frontline cuts.” (Polly Toynbee)
 
As we all know, Cameron only “rode to power” in 2010 on the backs of the Liberal Democrats. Despite having so many factors in their favour, the Tories couldn’t win the election outright, and their 36% share of the votes cast was their highest score in the last four general elections. The Tories haven’t won an election outright since 1992, when John Major lied his way back into office by promising “tax cuts year on year”, before proceeding to increase taxes more than any previous government in peacetime.
 
Tories have been around for a long time. The word ‘tory’ comes from the Gaelic ‘torai’, meaning ‘outlaw’ or ‘bandit’, so little has changed there. In the 17th century, Tories supported the king against Parliament. Although the Tory William Wilberforce was a leading campaigner against slavery, his party did not support its abolition, and it was left to a Whig government to end that evil practice in 1833, the year in which Wilberforce died. But then the Tories have always been ‘the nasty party’ (though that might be an understatement). 750,000 Irish people died of a potato famine in the 1840s because the Tories said ‘the free market’ would end the famine. (While those Irish people were starving to death, many Anglo-Irish estates continued to export grain and livestock to England.)
 
The Tories have rarely supported any of the reforms – such as education for all, the vote for all, the establishment of the welfare state and the NHS, legalised abortion and homosexuality – which in time came to be generally accepted as hallmarks of a civilised society. Yet until the arrival of Thatcher, the Tories sought not only to protect the rights of the rich and powerful (as they still do), but also to ‘conserve’ the status quo, whereas nowadays their mission is to asset-strip the state in support of their cronies and financial backers.
 
Despite having little or no empathy with the vast majority of the population, the Tories were, until quite recently, accepted as the natural party of government, and they were in power for about three-quarters of the last century. With more money than other parties and a largely supportive press, they operated a brilliant propaganda machine which persuaded or duped enough people into continually voting against their best interests. As Nye Bevan put it: “How can wealth persuade poverty to use its political freedom to keep wealth in power? That's the whole art of Tory politics.”
 
However, society has changed. Although far too many people are still brainwashed by the BBC into looking up to the medieval institution of hereditary monarchy, deferment to those with grand titles, pots of money and posh accents has declined rapidly since the 1960s. Britain has become multiracial and multicultural, and the most popular national dish isn’t steak and kidney pie or fish and chips but chicken tikka masala. Britain has been in the EU (and its predecessor, the EEC) for forty years, and the development of package holidays and cheap flights has broadened people’s horizons. Enough of us have realised that the world doesn’t end at Dover, and so the flag-waving ‘Little Englander’ mentality is now mainly the preserve of the saddos who support UKIP and the EDL. And of course we no longer have an empire, which used to make such people feel superior to the ‘Johnny Foreigners’ who were subjugated and exploited.
 
The Tories have failed to keep up with these changes, and their party membership reflects as much. At one time they had about 3 million members. When Cameron became their leader in 2005, they had 270,000 members, but now they have only 130,000. (By contrast, membership of the Labour Party has increased by 31,000 since Ed Miliband became leader.) Lord Feldman is the Tory co-chairman in charge of party membership. In 2011, he launched a membership drive which saw a further drop in membership! In the real world, failure on that scale would result in the sack, but Feldman, a close friend of Cameron with an office in Downing Street, remains in his post. Many of those who are still Tory Party members work themselves into a lather over equal marriage, which again shows how out of touch they are; I can’t believe that many of the people who are struggling to keep solvent and feed and clothe their children see such an issue as important.
 
Writing for ‘Conservative Home’, Paul Goodman points out that “Tory members have undergone one significant change in the last 25 years or so.  They are, on the whole, older people.” If the Tory Party can’t attract young people, isn’t it likely to die when its remaining members do? It may be that the Tories realise they are in terminal decline and that this may be their last ever time in power. That would explain the breakneck speed with which they are dismantling what’s left of the state following all the Thatcher and Major privatisations, which were dubbed by former Tory PM Harold Macmillan as “selling off the family silver”. Tory MP Douglas Carswell is certainly in no doubt that the Tories are in serious trouble:
 
“For a generation, the Conservative Party has been fighting a long retreat. An endangered species in much of the north of England, we are all but extinct in Scotland. Towns and cities across England that within living memory returned Conservative majorities to the town halls  and MPs to Parliament are now Tory-free. In many constituencies across the country, our local party structure is almost as hollow as our approach to the economy. HMV, the music retailer, went bust. Why? It had a declining market share and costly overheads. The Conservative Party is run a bit like HMV, and if it does not change, it will go the way of HMV.”
 
When Cameron became Tory leader, we were promised an end to the ‘nasty party’ image, but once in power again, the Tories have been more toxic than ever. We have a government conducting a systematic assault upon the sick, the poor and the disabled, slashing welfare budgets and forcing people off benefits. 500,000 of us now use food banks. They make it easier to sack us, make us work longer hours for less pay, force our kids to work for nothing, raise the retirement age whilst cutting our pensions and weaken our health and safety laws. And all just so a handful of people can be immensely rich.
 
Barring a rigged general election in 2015 – and we can’t rule anything out from a party that has tried to gerrymander the constituency boundaries, end automatic voter registration and cut off the finances of the main opposition party – the Tories will be toast. No governing party since 1974 has increased its percentage of the votes cast in the subsequent election (and then it was only because a second election was held after just seven months), and so the likelihood that the Tories will improve on their 36% share last time must be remote. Then the passage of time since the Tories last won an election outright will become even longer. Far-right headbangers have a natural home waiting for them in UKIP, blatant hypocrites can always link up with the Liberal Democrats, and the remaining Tory Party members will soon be having appointments with undertakers. So isn’t it time for this nasty, corrupt assortment of out-of-touch bigots, liars and losers known as the Tory Party to call it a day and disband?
 
Sources used:-
 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/27/ed-balls-prudent-full-throttle-fury
 
http://www.digitalhistory.uh.edu/historyonline/irish_potato_famine.cfm
 
http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/politics/2012/07/how-tory-membership-has-collapsed-under-cameron
 
http://conservativehome.blogs.com/thetorydiary/2013/05/by-paul-goodmanfollow-paul-on-twitter-there-are-activists-in-every-party-whose-eyes-arent-entirely-steady-in-their-sockets.html
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2287256/Tory-Party-run-like-HMV--way-says-Conservative-MP-Clacton-DOUGLAS-CARSWELL.html

Hello again everyone! Hope you're all well?

It won't happen sickchip, too many people are only interested in number one, Thatcher taught them well! Plus, why should they get off their arses when they can be spoon fed bullshit via that square shaped thing in the corner of their living rooms? As long as the masses can feast on X factor and Britain's got talent then everything in the garden is rosy!

Adele,

Yes. You are right, of course.....more's the pity.

I believe British people would put up with any hardships / cruelties / injustices their masters would deign to inflict.

boatlady wrote:I care what happens to the vast mass of working people

Me too, Penderyn, specially as I've always counted myself as one of them.
As a member of that group, I say we need a government that first of all is not Tory, that second of all will at least try to introduce some fair policies.
The current Labour front bench are, it's true, very middle class and mostly privately educated; however, at the moment I might prefer a bit of paternalism to the out and out class war being waged by the current government.

We do need some form of government, and that does need to be formed by an organisation that is capable of being elected under the current system.

For examples of bloody revlolution, I refer you to Russia 1917, Egypt, still, France 1789. None of that appeals to me.

Currently, we have a government that, against international law, is waging war on the weaker and more vulnerable members of society - they are killing people on a daily basis. The last Labour government didn't do that, and I don't think they'd do that if they were back in power, so as far as I'm concerned they're a much preferable option to the status quo.

I would like the kind of Revelution the one that France had in 1789, this appeals to me and it would let the people of the UK get there own back on the Nasty Tories plus they would not be around for people to vote for there LIES and SPIN.

Adele Carlyon wrote:Hello again everyone! Hope you're all well?

It won't happen sickchip, too many people are only interested in number one, Thatcher taught them well! Plus, why should they get off their arses when they can be spoon fed bullshit via that square shaped thing in the corner of their living rooms? As long as the masses can feast on X factor and Britain's got talent then everything in the garden is rosy!

Hi Adele good to see you again, you and sickchip are rather down on the people of the UK, never say never everyone has there breaking point and this gov't think we are a bunch of NINNIES willing to let them push us around UNTIL WE SNAP then all HELL will break lose.

Nice to see you back Adele.
I hope you're wrong

boatlady wrote:Nice to see you back Adele.
I hope you're wrong

So do I boatlady but people need to wake up and smell the coffee

Thanks Boatlady, and hi Redflag! I hope I'm wrong too, but I'm desperately trying to figure out just what it will take to shake people out of their slumber! After all, we are many, they are few!

I think most people are keeping their heads down because the cuts are not affecting them YET Adele, but that will change soon. The Tories do not care who their cuts affect as long as its not their own kind ie went to Eton Oxford or Cambridge, they are the ones that are set to get huge gov't contracts or tax cuts.

Ivan,

Sorry to say but I think you're underestimating the Tory party, and overestimating the British electorate.

 
Sickchip, I do not think Ivan is underestimating the Tory party, he knows they will be underhand and will have plenty of dirty tricks up their sleeves in an attempt to win the 2015 general election because they know how it will look if the voting public chuck them out in 2015.  As for the people of the UK here I am not sure what is going on, I remember what they did when the Poll Tax that Thatcher brought in, they were up in arms out in the streets marching, bursting into Council meetings, yet this Tory gov't have brought in so many cuts and the only people who are protesting are the Unions, but I do wish they would wake up and smell the coffee before it's too late.

Hello Red,

A year or two ago I would have said the Tory party have no chance of winning the next election......but given the insipid, vapid, and uninspiring performance of Labour in opposition - and the mass psychosis that seems to have befell much of the electorate, I'd say it is finely balanced and anybody's guess who our next government will be - not that it will make much difference....since the song/agenda will remain the same.

This week, I met a Tory voter who also claims ESA and had had their claim disallowed folowing an 'assessment' be ATOS. They were accused of lying about their disability (like so many) and are now awaiting a Tribunal (at which of course they will have no legal representation).
I've never enjoyed schadenfreude - but came close when they bewailed their abandonment by their chosen party - they thought all the benefit reforms were really great as long as they applied to someone else.
Did mention that a General Election is coming and they might want to consider which party REALLY looks after disabled, sick and vulnerable people.
 

The reason we have enjoyed a Tory-led coalition for three years was Voter Apathy in 2010.

Will things be different in 2015?

If everyone who's been adversely affected by this Condem government's destructive policies would go out and vote Labour, there'd be a landslide in 2015. The government has alienated every section of society - young people, the disabled, women, police, teachers, NHS workers etc.

Hello and Welcome to CE Sharonavraham, I agree that Labour should get a landslide in 2015, but the Rd and the Labour MPs need to come out attacking this Tory led gov't, they have let the Tories away with so much starting from 2010 when they allowed the Tories to get away with "The Miss Labour Left" this drip drip effect had people believing Labour had borrowed too much to throw about like a man with no arms. When the truth was they had borrowed so much to BAIL OUT the Tory donors and friends in the City bankers and hedge fund managers, this must end and the Labour party need to go for the Tories Jugular vein of the Tory party.

Tory foot soldiers are deserting the battlefield
 
Extracts from an article by Matthew Holehouse:-
 
How many Tories are left? In the 1950s membership was north of three million, and wealthy local associations bought grand town houses to turn into Conservative Clubs with bars and handsome dining rooms and dances every Friday night. Now the party's own MPs openly admit the figure could be lower than 100,000, around half Labour’s membership. Speak to those in the party outside Westminster, and they will tell you their branches are withering. They fear Labour will hold and gain seats in a string of marginals because the troops the Tories need to fight the ground war have gone. The average age of a local association is in the sixties, and many of the most loyal lack the energy to spend long hours on the doorstep.

“It’s an emergency” says Ben Harris-Quinney, director of the Conservative Grassroots campaign group. “It’s a dire situation which is going to significantly constrain our ability to win in 2015 and beyond. Losing 70% of our members is not something that can be reversed quickly. The writing's on the wall because there’s no new blood coming in.”

It's the same refrain in the cities and the rural heartlands. “We simply can’t get people to come out” says one Tory organiser in West London, who has become weary of seeing dozens of young lawyers and accountants at party drinks events, but only half a dozen out on action days. “The party base has shrunk hugely and the thin band of those willing to leaflet and canvass is now close to extinction” wrote Keith Mitchell, the former leader of Oxfordshire County Council.
 
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/matthewholehouse/100230456/tory-footsoldiers-are-deserting-the-battlefield-it-could-cost-them-the-election/

Adele Carlyon wrote:Hello again everyone! Hope you're all well?

It won't happen sickchip, too many people are only interested in number one, Thatcher taught them well! Plus, why should they get off their arses when they can be spoon fed bullshit via that square shaped thing in the corner of their living rooms? As long as the masses can feast on X factor and Britain's got talent then everything in the garden is rosy!

If only the halfbaked noodles COULD be interested in Number one we'd have this system cleared out tomorrow. If people would realise that we have one life and its soon over we'd be on the way, and I don't think it's that hard. Most people don't really want to brainless clods in cages - they are just brainwashed, and if the likes of Labour won't fight, how are they going to wake up?

Numerically, the problem is not the quantity of Party Members, but of the aspirational swathe of voters who have been conditioned to think that if you want to get ahead it's best to identify with the Boss class.

oftenwrong wrote:Numerically, the problem is not the quantity of Party Members, but of the aspirational swathe of voters who have been conditioned to think that if you want to get ahead it's best to identify with the Boss class.

Party members have no voice, so there is no point in them, surely? There have always been mugs who want to lick the boss's arse to turn themselves into princes too, and blacklegs. The question is how we wake up the mugs who seem prepared to eat grass and obey morons for nothing. They could stop all this crap tomorrow.

How about another topic?

Is the Labour Party a Tory Party that should be disbanded?

If the Labour party does not pull its socks up bloody well QUICK there will be nothing left to disband sickchip, now the shadow cabinet are coming out Andy Burnham has said the same thing as yourself if they want to win the next general election in 2015 with a majority and not have to rely on a coalition with another party and give the UK what it needs "A FAIR GOV'T FOR ALL" not for the Elite few at the top of the money tree.

MAYBE WE SHOULD DISBAND THE TORY PARTY SO THIS WILL NEVER BE INFLICTED ON MY FUTURE FAMILY IVAN.

Is the Tory Party an anachronism which should be disbanded?

The Tory Party should be roundly defeated at the next General Election, but kept on as a constant reminder to voters of what happens if they cease to be vigilant.

For the same reason as we have War Memorials: "Lest we forget".

Quite agree OW "We should Never Forget" and make sure that the rest of the UK do not forget either by reminding people just how we were reminded about the "Poll Tax"

Does the narrow and regressive Tory Party have a death wish?
 
Extracts from an article by Will Hutton:-
 
"The Conservative Party is at odds and at a loss. The combination of UKIP, voter disaffection and the ongoing pressure on living standards means the likelihood of Cameron doing what neither Thatcher nor Blair managed to do – lifting the share of the vote after an initial general election victory – is very low. For the Tory Party whose vocation is to rule, this is unacceptable and it is opening up a fundamental debate about what Toryism means.

The country does not like Tory policies and values. Britain at its core has a profound commitment to fair play and the rule of law; it has a good-humoured decency and pride in the country. The institutions that command its affections include the NHS, the BBC, the tortured Church of England, the National Theatre, the courts, the British army, all of which in varying degrees are wholly detached from the contemporary Conservative project. The Tories are not just the party of the rich – they have gone rogue.

The interaction of a conservative, Thatcher-celebrating media with Conservative Party constituency associations that in effect command rotten boroughs, despite their tiny membership, has made internal Tory politics close to unmanageable. MPs are returned reflecting comfort-zone politics rather than those of a broader coalition. The result is that the animating element in today's Toryism is a British version of the American Tea Party: an uncompromising and unrepresentative ideological faction capable of massive political disruption but zero creativity."
 
For the full article and reader comments:-
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/24/david-cameron-tory-party-politics

Redflag wrote:Hello and Welcome to CE Sharonavraham, I agree that Labour should get a landslide in 2015, but the Rd and the Labour MPs need to come out attacking this Tory led gov't, they have let the Tories away with so much starting from 2010 when they allowed the Tories to get away with "The Miss Labour Left" this drip drip effect had people believing Labour had borrowed too much to throw about like a man with no arms. When the truth was they had borrowed so much to BAIL OUT the Tory donors and friends in the City bankers and hedge fund managers, this must end and the Labour party need to go for the Tories Jugular vein of the Tory party.

On Today this morning, that doyen of generosity and support for the disadvantaged, George 'the workers friend' Osborne was interviewed on his wonderful, innovative and fresh approach to pay day loans.

There was no Labour Party input and none was required. By the end Evan, who had a lot of trouble getting any sort of straight answer from Georgie boy, had let George hang himself. He blustered that Labour had done nothing about a market that did not exist whilst they were in power; he also failed to explain why he was undercutting his own regulator; he also sunk in the quicksand of interfering in a free market.

Labour is talking to the public directly. They are not debating with the Tories and it is working. Energy costs and pay day loans are at the top of the list of social concerns. Rightly or wrongly Labour appears to have a plan or at least an attitude. The Tories are left playing catch up and today's Today interview was exactly that and it showed. Georgie boy HAD to come on and respond even though he had to end up looking left behind.

I think this is definitely a case where 'all guns blazing' is the wrong approach. 'Softly, softly. catchee monkey' is what Labour are doing and it is working.

Good post bellatori and since I did not see the interview on Today I thank you for the update of what was said, just to put the record straight Stella Creasy Labour MP has tried twice to get a private members bill through the H.O.C to cap the interest charges of the Pay Day Loan SHARKS and twice the Tories and Lib-Dems have stopped the bill dead in its tracks. No wonder Diddy Giddy does not want to bring in regulations for these Sharks Lord Beecroft Tory donor has shares in Wonga and Quick Quid another pond life company has another Tory Lord/donor at its helm.
 
I tend to think you're spot on with "Softly softly catchee Monkey", it was always the Labour party's plan not to fight fire with fire but let the Tories SHAME THEMSELVES in the eyes of the UK voters.:yeahthat:

But when will the worm turn, you may ask?

oftenwrong wrote:But when will the worm turn, you may ask?

I tend to think the "WORM" is gettting a bit Restless OW, so that could mean this year for the worm to turn. :yeahthat: 

Scottish Tories have been having their annual conference in Edinburgh this weekend. They banned one of their own members from attending because he supports Scottish independence, but they had to send out invitations to non-party members in a bid to fill the empty seats at the conference.
 
http://www.sundaypost.com/news-views/politics/indy-supporting-tory-banned-from-scottish-conference-1.271164
 
Here’s a picture of the auditorium, packed with young and vibrant Tories:-
 

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bi2lWmfCEAArkSM.jpg

I watched this live on BBC2 Ivan and it was as empty as your photo shows. I was wondering where they all came from, as you know Ivan Edinburgh Zoo has more Pandas than Scotland has Tories.
 
But all Ruth Davidson (leader of Scottish Tories) did was repeat Osborne's mantra plus she reckons because England has to to pay for their prescriptions Scotland should pay also(exemptions for young & pensioners) although Wales and Northern Ireland have free prescriptions Scotland under her gov't would have to pay.
 
If Ruth thinks she will ever get the Scots to vote Tory she had better be prepared to keep her hand on her butt for a very long time, we see what she is doing down south and that is enough to put anybody off voting Tory, without our own experience of getting the Poll Tax one year before England was hit with it.  

Redflag. Isn't it amazing that Ruth Davidson's answer to free prescriptions in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland isn't to suggest that they should be free in England as well? It's just the same with the Tory line on benefits and wages. It's always that benefits are too high, not that wages are in many cases too low for people to live on.
 
Apparently, at the conference in Edinburgh today, the Tory sheep were herded into the centre of the auditorium to make the place look crowded on camera:-
 

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bi2ofoTCEAAztPV.jpg

Reminds me of those panorama school photographs. There was always one bright spark who would run round the back from the left-hand side to the right-hand side so as to appear in the photo twice.

I hope the conference wasn't too lengthy.

Some of those people would need to be taken back to the mortuary before the refrigeration wore off...          

 

Phil Hornby wrote:I hope the conference wasn't too lengthy.

Some of those people would need to be taken back to the mortuary before the refrigeration wore off...          

 
You have a good point there PH, Scotland is watching and waiting for these old Tory Incontinents to drop off this mortal coil then Scotland will have NO TORIES at all WHOOPEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Could we be witnessing the death of the Conservative Party?
 
Extracts from an article by Luke Akehurst:-
 
“The Tories have historically been the dominant political party in British politics, and pragmatists adept at adjusting their political approach to match the mood of the electorate, as in the post-war period when they accepted the NHS and Welfare State. Thatcher’s more ideological approach created a new coalition for them, including temporarily some blue collar ex-Labour voters attracted by right-to-buy and share ownership in privatised companies. But Thatcher’s evisceration of UK’s manufacturing and the damage this did to communities meant there are swathes of the North of England, Scotland and Wales that are now no-go areas for the Tories.

Tory Party membership has collapsed to 134,000 from 253,000 when Cameron was elected leader in 2005. Those members who remain are increasingly elderly; 61% are over 60. This decline in their activist base is important because in close-run elections like 2010, and most likely 2015, ability to mobilise volunteer activists in key marginals could decide the outcome.

The Tories last won a majority in the 1992 election. Even presented in 2010 with an unpopular Labour government and PM and an economic crisis, they ended up 20 seats short of a majority, on just 36% of the vote. The best they can play for in 2015 is another hung parliament; their vote is distributed in a way that does not help them win the FPTP elections they stupidly campaigned to defend in the 2011 referendum. They stack up votes with big majorities in seats they will always win and which are not the battleground.”
 
For the whole article:-
http://labourlist.org/2014/04/could-we-be-witnessing-the-death-of-the-conservative-party/

The Tory Party could equally be named "The Wealthy Party". If it were to disband itself tomorrow, Britain would have another Party identified with the Rich, safeguarding their interests, within three months.

To be honest it is the just about comfortably-off people who align themselves with the Tory Party so that they can feel 'accepted' by the rich ( who actually despise them) who annoy me most.

They buy cars and other items which are, in reality, too expensive for them, just so that the really well-heeled at the Golf Club ( where fees are , in truth, just a bit of a squeeze) will smile benignly at them as they sip those G&Ts which take the last of the cash which they can muster that month.

What fools, as they talk about their substantial 'Stock Market investments' ( actually funded by that £1000 that Auntie Bessie left them in her Will) just loud enough for bystanders to hear !

I would go on, but I have dinner at the Lodge tonight, don't you know...