Iain Duncan Smith

First topic message reminder :

Is this government right to set out a new criteria by which poverty in Britain is measured or is it just a case of moving the goal posts to help them meet a target?

Poverty Measure To Be Redefined By Iain Duncan Smith

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/06/14/poverty-measure-to-be-redefined_n_1595677.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

oftenwrong wrote:There is comfort to be found in the likelihood that many Tory Party supporters must be hideously embarrassed to find themselves linked with such as IDS.

Come the general election OW that is going to get worse when the Tories find themselves linked to FARAGE & UKIP

We don't even need to wait that long, Red.

Elections to the European Parliament will be held in all member states of the European Union (EU) between 22 and 25 May 2014.

Many clichés will apply: Cat among the pigeons, Sh1t or bust!, Birds of a feather, Softly, softly, Takes one to know one, etc., etc.

It's the Referendum that everyone says they want. Don't they?

It's the Referendum that everyone says they want. Don't they?

That was tongue-in-cheek, I presume!

1% of voters regard the EU as "the most important issue" facing Britain (compared to apparently 90% of Tory backbenchers) and just 7% regard it as "one of the most important issues".

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/05/tories-have-descended-madness-europe-labour-should-leave-them-it

Now please let's get back to our genial friend IDS, before we get attacked again by one of the usual suspects for "going off topic ALL the time with little or nothing said".......

Iain Duncan Smith's Great-Grandmother was Japanese.

Don't know whether that's on topic or not.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2001/sep/03/conservatives.uk

oftenwrong wrote:Iain Duncan Smith's Great-Grandmother was Japanese.

Don't know whether that's on topic or not.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2001/sep/03/conservatives.uk

We have all heard about the cruelty from the Japanese during the second world war OW so maybe that explains his NASTINESS ?

Iain Duncan Smith's Great-Grandmother was Japanese.

No!!

"self-servatives" is about right. He and that Lord Freud are cruel uncaring and worthless. Pike Staffs come to mind.

Mel wrote:"self-servatives" is about right. He and that Lord Freud are cruel uncaring and worthless. Pike Staffs come to mind.

Mel I am certain we could put those Pike Staffs to better use, like ramming them up where the sun don't shine on IBS and Lord Freud.

Red, I wrote to my local MP (Lib Dem) about my disabled brother being railroaded to attend an ATOS appointment. I asked many questions about the affects that Welfare Reforms are having on mentally handicapped people and the inplications of suicide.

I eventually received a pathetic reply of nothing but waffle.
A complete and utter waste of time.

An historical footnote:

http://www.ushmm.org/museum/exhibit/focus/disabilities/

Mel wrote:Red, I wrote to my local MP (Lib Dem) about my disabled brother being railroaded to attend an ATOS appointment.  I asked many questions about the affects that Welfare Reforms are having on mentally handicapped people and the inplications of suicide.

I eventually received a pathetic reply of nothing but waffle.
A complete and utter waste of time.

I do not think ramming a Pike Staff up where the sun don't shine would not help Mel, it would help me to feel better plus it would be a while before any of them could sit down without being in pain and suffering.

Did you expect anything but Pathetic from a Lib-Dem Mel the whole lot of them lack BACKBONE of any shape or form.

Original including links at http://wp.me/p2sftc-8QG

My series of posts about the fake psychometric ‘test’ and the DWP/Cabinet Office’s attempts to deny it, became big news earlier this year. Among the facts that the DWP denied, then admitted, then denied again and admitted again, were:

- they were threatening jobseekers with benefit sanction if they refused to participate
- that no qualified psychologists were involved in the decision to threaten potentially-vulnerable into becoming guinea-pigs
- that no training was given to Jobcentre Plus (JCP) advisers in how to select people for the test beyond telling them to do it
- that the experiment had been subjected to none of the usual validations or safeguards

and more. The whole thing stank of the contemptuous, reckless attitude of the DWP and the Cabinet Office’s ‘Nudge Unit’ toward unemployed people.

It turns out that the psychological abuse of jobseekers – and the abuse of psychology by the government – are by no means limited to the fake test.

Disability benefit claimants are able to ask for their Work Capability Assessments (WCA – usually conducted by Atos) interviews and assessments to be recorded. The DWP’s guidance states that claimants do not have a legal right to record, but that

all requests will be accommodated where possible

The guidance also states that recording requests should always be submitted in advance, and that

Although this may slow down the benefit process it will not affect your entitlement to benefit.

(More on WCA recordings here if you need it).

Many disabled people have complained that obstacles are placed in the way of any wish to record Atos assessments. But if you’re not disabled and are simply unemployed, it appears that these commonsense rules do not even apply in theory. On the contrary, if you ask to record your JCP interviews, it appears you are likely to be labelled psychologically unstable – and deprived of your benefits.

A jobseeker has forwarded me a copy of correspondence sent to them because they insisted that they wished to record their interviews at the JCP – a request which is more than reasonable in a context of such ridiculous decisions as sanctioning a claimant for attending a job interview – something so ridiculous that even the Daily Mail condemned it!

The two documents in question are quite stunning in what they demonstrate about how claimants are regarded and treated by many within the benefits system under this government. Here’s the main letter:



The claimant was referred to a ‘work psychologist’ simply for wanting to record his/her JCP interviews. The psychologist – contrary to the guidance given to disabled people – states that the request to have interviews recorded is impacting on benefit entitlement, a thinly-veiled threat that the claimant will be sanctioned or have his/her claim discontinued if s/he refused to stop asking. The claimant is then asked to sign and return the following ‘reply slip’:



A stark choice: attend the ‘discussion’ and agree not to record it, or don’t agree – and don’t attend (with obvious consequences for the continuation of benefits.

Each time I think it couldn’t be plainer that this government despises the unemployed and has set up the system to torture them, it turns out I’m wrong. But it’s very, very evident that our current excuse for ‘leadership’ considers psychological abuse a perfectly acceptable measure to take against jobseekers for even the most reasonable requests – or for that matter, just for existing.

Iain Duncan Smith has denied that his flagship scheme to overhaul the benefits system has been an “IT disaster”, as he blamed civil servants who “just wanted to say it was all going well”.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10288026/Iain-Duncan-Smith-denies-Universal-Credit-is-an-IT-disaster.html

oftenwrong wrote:Iain Duncan Smith has denied that his flagship scheme to overhaul the benefits system has been an “IT disaster”, as he blamed civil servants who “just wanted to say it was all going well”.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10288026/Iain-Duncan-Smith-denies-Universal-Credit-is-an-IT-disaster.html

It appears that IDS was supposed to appear before the Work & Pensions committee yesterday 4th Setember to explain his stats, so knowing he would be hauled over the coals for lying about the stats he made an excuse up to avoid the mauling and has changed his appearance to October but even that is not definate. There is a report in todays paper by the National Audit Office which says Bedroom Tax is costing more than it is saving, and Universal Credit is in dire trouble and it could be 2017 before it comes out.

Wonder if anyone is logging the costs of austerity (£300,000,000 + for new computer equipment, including £34,000,000 that has to be written off because it's no use)
As reported on Radio 4 news this morning - haven't checked the figures as yet.

The history of IT in Government lists a series of disasters, over-runs and write-offs stretching backwards from today to a time when British computers were manufactured by a company called Ferranti.

Anyone care to hazard a guess how long ago that was?

1765? 

This Tory led so called Coalition has and will continue to waste taxpayers money on the road to destroy anything brought in by any past Labour government that assists the poor the sick and the needy. Whilst on the other hand looking after themselves and their rich friends by way of wealth transfer from bottom to top.
It should be as plain as a pike staff to the electorate. I fear many do not get it or perhaps just do not care.
Thatcher's doctrine continued, dog eat dog and i'm alright Jack, i'm afraid.

Well said Mel I agree with your summary, it will just make Eds job that bit harder in 2015 but then he needs to show the public every nasty bill that him and Cleggy put through the H.O.C, which private company got it and its relationship to the Tory party or how much they had donated to the Tory party before they got the contract, but they will need to show the paper work to prove it.

More evidence of that the tories are sadistic and deliberately disenfranchising many of the means to progress their lives.

This is truly sickening stuff, and there must surely be some law against human rights being broke.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/08/duncan-smith-poverty-benefit-sanctions-easterhouse

Lovely article. I was particularly touched by the bit "Tim Montgomerie, founder of ConservativeHome and now the Times comment editor, arranged that visit as Duncan Smith's adviser. When Holman asked why, he was told: "We're interested in compassionate Conservatism.""
 
However they all went for a lie down in a darkened room, took a couple of aspirins and the feeling passed...

Mel wrote:It's a bloody joke chip, except it's not at all funny if you get my drift.

After I wrote my last post I glanced up and saw this. I thought that if I finished my post with --- This really is very funny so why aren't we all laughing? --- it might be construed as tasteless so I left it off. But as you say, its true. So why aren't we all laughing?

I wasn't aware that anyone doubted that Duncan Smith was a despicable and cruel individual who revels in creating misery for the type of people who cannot fight back. The only question is just HOW much does he enjoy it?

With those credentials he is surely destined to be a Tory hero...

"He wept at the plight of the poor, yet now hands out punishments that must bring tears to their eyes."

 
sickchip. Thanks for bringing that excellent article by Polly Toynbee to our attention. I suspect that some of our members don’t always bother to click on and read links in posts, so I thought I’d post a few extracts from that one to whet people’s appetites:-
 
In the last three months the government boasts of 120,000 fewer unemployed claimants, in contrast with the much larger numbers shown in the internationally recognised labour force survey of numbers wanting work. It's a win-win for Duncan Smith, who can pretend that all who have left the register are working, although many are now queuing at food banks.

Duncan Smith's sanctions cause a special kind of hell for jobcentre staff. A regular ‘deep throat’ correspondent describes the work: "Sanctions are applied for anything at all to hit the targets. People are often sanctioned for a no-show at appointments they never knew about. If they call to rearrange an appointment, we don't answer the phones, so that's a bit tricky. Someone with a disability who is knocked off ESA can reclaim while awaiting an appeal. But we are explicitly forbidden from telling them that.”

A flowchart on the wall shows how to raise a successful sanction. A "PIP" (personal improvement plan) for each member of staff detects low sanctioners and "manages them out" of their jobs.

Advisers are so busy knocking off easy, vulnerable cases that they have no time to chase up devious criminal gangs and fraudsters who take longer to catch. Meanwhile, out of fear or confusion, many stop trying to claim, only to have Duncan Smith pretend they must be cheats who have been chased away. He invents figures, defying even the UK Statistics Authority's rebukes. He churns out reports that blame poverty on the poor and their failure to marry, while all his own policies are in crisis.
 
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/08/duncan-smith-poverty-benefit-sanctions-easterhouse
 
And the Liberal Democrats have allowed all this to happen. Don’t forget that if you’re ever tempted to vote tactically.

Thanks Ivan.

It made my blood boil reading it; but it is an excellent article. One would think jobcentre staff are there to advise and help those unfortunate enough to become unemployed - instead 'advisers' are instructed by the tories to engage in a dirty tricks campaign against the unemployed. How low can this government go?

sickchip wrote:Thanks Ivan.

It made my blood boil reading it; but it is an excellent article. One would think jobcentre staff are there to advise and help those unfortunate enough to become unemployed - instead 'advisers' are instructed by the tories to engage in a dirty tricks campaign against the unemployed. How low can this government go?

Don't be pessimistic. Give them some credit. I am sure they will keep trying.   They are experts at limbo dancing.

There genuinely is nothing new under the sun.

Similar discussions about apartheid in South Africa marvelled at the enthusiasm of black Police in supressing opposition from the natives to White Rule.

It was also established as fact in 1945 that no German civilians had ever really supported the Nazi Party.

This evil bastard should be on trial at The Hague for crimes against humanity:-
 
Iain Duncan Smith 'targeting seriously ill claimants' in benefits overhaul
 
"The fate of nearly 550,000 benefit claimants currently deemed unfit for work due to serious illnesses such as cancer is in the balance as it emerged that Iain Duncan Smith is planning a radical change to the welfare system."
 
For the details and some excellent reader responses:-
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/nov/23/iain-duncan-smith-wrag-benefit-cuts

Fertile ground for any number of factually-based attacks, day after day, from  a competent Opposition in (a televised) Parliament, one would think.

And yet, and yet...    

If Iain Dumkopf Schmidt really wants to save some money, he could have suitable hospitals erected and place all of our sick and disabled in one centre. Over the gate could be the words which where actually used by him "work makes you free" uncannily similar to the motto used by Nazi Germany "Arbeit macht frei" over the gates of their extermination camps.
To keep costs low he could have a minimal medical staff well versed in practicing surgery without anaesthetic to further save on cost.
He could cut the nursing staff by placing barbed wire around his new establishment thereby concentrating the patients in one easily controlled environment .
Space would become an issue so in order to save having to purchase any new land for what would be an ever growing cemetery, he could opt for cremation and use the heat from said cremation to heat swimming pools and the ash to fertilise the garden where the patients grow their own food.
Change the patients to inmates then voila you have the answer "Concentration Camps" You know it makes sense???

Brilliant and perceptive proposals.

Have you ever considered a career as a Tory politician, bobby...?      

If our prayers concerning IDS go unanswered, it may confirm the Faustian legend.

Source: YouTube

Where's a Lee Harvey Oswald when you need one?

Oh no, bobby. Not a swift bullet to the head. Not nearly adequate.
What was it that MI5 liked to do with "suspects"? Rendition. Just good old government remedies for what ails you.

"Questionable numbers have floated out of IDS's office into the public debate like raw sewage." ('The Economist')

Three articles by George Eaton which remind us just how unfit for office Iain Duncan Smith is:-

Universal Credit has "not achieved value for money", warns National Audit Office

In the accounts, which have now been released, the National Audit Office states that Universal Credit has "not achieved value for money", noting that the DWP has written off £40.1m of assets developed for the programme "as it will never use them" and that "it also now expects to write down £91.0 million of the remaining assets to nil value by March 2018, due to the considerable reduction in their expected useful life."

In more bad news for IDS, the report also shows that the amount of money lost to fraud and error in the benefits system has risen from £3.2bn (2% of the total budget) last year to £3.5bn (2.1%). Of this total, £700m (0.4%) was lost due to official error, £1.6bn (0.9%) to claimant error and £1.2bn (0.7%) to fraud. It's worth noting that the latter figure is lower than the amount lost last year due to benefit underpayments: £1.4bn (0.9%). But don't expect the DWP to publicise that in its briefings.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/12/universal-credit-has-not-achieved-value-money-warns-nao

Duncan Smith tries to run away from failure on Universal Credit

The Work and Pensions Secretary says he "never wanted to dwell on figures" after the OBR forecasts less than 10% of his original target will be met.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/12/duncan-smith-tries-run-away-failure-universal-credit

Duncan Smith blames Conservative HQ for statistics abuse

Duncan Smith bullishly pointed out that he "believed" thousands of people had moved into work as a result of the introduction of the benefit cap, despite the UKSA warning that this was "unsupported by the official statistics".

But when he was questioned on the false statement by Conservative chairman Grant Shapps that "nearly a million people" (878,300) on incapacity benefit dropped their claims, rather than face a new medical assessment for the employment and support allowance (which resulted in another reprimand from the Statistics Authority to Duncan Smith and Shapps), he took a strikingly different line. Rather than defending the claim, he replied that it was "nothing to do with the department" and blamed CCHQ for the inaccurate "conflation of data".

Speaking from what appeared to most to be a glass house, he added: "I've tried to get my colleagues at Central Office to check first before they put anything out about the areas that the DWP covers because it's complex". One was left with the image of Duncan Smith pleading with Shapps and other Tory apparatchiks not to twist statistics for the purposes of political propaganda but his own record meant he received little sympathy from the committee.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/12/duncan-smith-blames-conservative-hq-statistics-abuse

"Conflation" verb use of numbers by the Tory Party?