Is the EU responsible for the deaths of millions of people?

Today at this very moment as i type this, some starving africans will have died from,well starvation,,whilst at the same time somewhere in europe a trawler will be throwing away dead fish that doesnt quite fit an eu regulation, a supermarket will be filling it's skips up with food that has to be thrown away only because of an eu regulation and not becasue there is anything wrong with it,,same with farms,,,this is just pure planned and deliberate EVIL, when i see what the billions of pounds worth of aid buys,,i am a little shocked to say the least as i have never seen anything more than a few wooden shacks some tents , a water well and some sacks of rice and loads of french and german people wearing masks injecting everyone with something,,when i expect to see infrastructure and well,,whole bloody townships for that ammount of cash,,,would it not be better to use said aid money to freeze and transport this perfectley nutritional food to the african continent instead of a stupid rule made up by some german/frenchie that says it all has to be thrown away,,or is it just fine and dandy that because of these eu rules,,millions have to die needlessly?.

so which is best?

throw the food and let millions die

or use aid money to ship it over?

and any decent reason why the EU doesnt do this and would much rather let millions starve and die......needlessly?.

your thoughts plz.

The problem always with aid to third-world countries is that it distorts their economy. Human nature is to accept the bounty and stop struggling for self-sufficiency, so that even the little they were achieving previously on their own, has been abandoned.

Just look at the tropical islands which have been "helped" to develop tourism. The only benefit to the locals is that they now know how to be waiters, chambermaids and taxi-drivers.

Forty years ago, Oxfam posters were displaying the saying: "Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for life". Of course that was before fish stocks became depleted......

So it's best to just let them die and waste the aid money then?,,,sounds alot like "well who cares if we are gassing them,,they are only jews after all".

I bet somewhere amongst all of Hitlers solutions,,,starvation of black people was one.

The European Union is the largest aid donor in the world, giving more materials, support, money and emergency relief than China or the United States.

Ref: European fishing rules

As a boy of 14 I can remember my grandfather saying that one day the trawlers would fish the seas dry, and that in my lifetime I would see restrictions on fishing, he died in 1976 but his words came true.

My grandfather fished out of Whitby most of his life apart from the war years when he served in the Royal Navy.

Perhaps the current rules are unfair, stupid or dont make sense, but one thing is certain - the only people to blame for restrictions are the trawlermen themselves, fishing on the scale they did for 40 years was bound to end in species been driven to near extinction.

Mother nature can only take so much

So we agree then,,it's better to let millions of these starving africans die needlessly,,a simple yes or no would have sufficed but if you want to hide behind euro rules and use them as an excuse fair enough.

so the fisherman are going to cause a fish to die and the eu an entire continent?.wow

the only people to blame for restrictions are the trawlermen themselves,

Things are NO better now, look at the seine netters and the other kind, using 3 trawlers, a mile between each!

It was said along the Moray Firth that you could not bathe in the water for fear of being picked off the beach by a French Trawler!

Back to the mists of time, Dutch, Spanish and French Trawlers have had the right to fish in parts of UK waters even before the EU was formed.

That these nationalities have milked the system is not in doubt, and when they fished out their own patch they moved over the bed a bit, into the local man's patch.
Yer hexpurts have NEVER put any accusations toward the foreign nationalities in the media, I wonder why? Always saying, like Withcy that THE FISHERMEN have caused their own problems.

AND don't get me started on the boatss howking oot sand eels to fill the Russian "Lumpers" to be used for mere fertiliser! Gannet, Tern and Puffin populations starved to death because of this largesse, which is where my intrest comes from.

nin, if \\\\unesco and ANY of the other organisations were any good at their job this would have been sorted out years ago! These organisations can be dated back to the late 40s, so that is 70 years of playing.

IMO, the ONLY way to get these organisations to cut the mustard, is to put ALL the fancy pant "delegates" in one room, lock the door and tell them "Yer dinnae get fed until yerv'e thrashed oot an agreement"

Name a living Scottish Diplomat, I know not of any, so I have no role models, therefore my "diplomatic skills! may be a little bit rusty.

I just dont want to be told not to waste food and what not,,when the EU forces hundreds of millions of us to waste tons of it every second,,especially when they put tv adverts of starving black babies(never the parents though?) on whilst i am eating my tea..secondly if anyone can tell me of a legitimate answer to why aid money cannot be used to freeze and transport all this WASTE to those starving africans,,i would like to hear it..appears a perfectley sensible fiz to a disgusting evil problem (millions die whilst we are forced to throw away by the germans and french).

i cannot understand how anyone could support such people,,,i say if calling a black person the N word is racism,,then what is allowing millions of them to die from starvation,,,,tell a starving african that he/she cant eat that carrot because it's the wrong shape....shame on those who support these modern day nazis.(or germans as my grandad called em,,never once called em nazis,,just germans)

The simple fact is: Fishermen are in it to make money, like all other businesses. There is no money in keeping your ship full of fish that you can't sell on more lucrative European, Asian, or North American markets. There's really little more to it than that. The EU would have to pay these fishermen fair market value for their catch and also pay the processing companies, transportation companies, and distribution companies to actually get their fish into the hands of the Africans. Highly perishable food items like fish is far more expensive to keep fresh and disease-free than non-perishable items such as canned food that only needs to be stored. Most of these starving Africans do not have freezers in their homes, either, so individuals cannot store fish and would literally have to eat it within hours of receiving it, making fish an impractical food to donate.

I know it seems like an easy solution to just ship the non-regulation fish off to Africa, but it's more complicated (and far more expensive) than it first appears. With so many EU nations undergoing austerity programs, some like Greece on the threshold of open revolt, and every EU nation raiding their couch cushions hoping to find more money, the tens of millions (if not billions) of Euros to keep fishermen in business while they make room on their ships for worthless fish simply are not there. It doesn't do anyone any good if the fishermen end up starving themselves!

Thousands of tons of Spider Crabs are caught off the coasts of southern England and sold for a good price into the Spanish market. British diners can't be bothered with the pesky things.

But there's a dog-in-a-manger Group that criticises the practice.

shirina,,,stop making excuses,,we are talking billions in aid money,,and food doesnt just need fridge to keep it fresh,,there are other ways,,smokin and curing,,

put a dried fish in front of a starving african and see whether it gets eaten

make all the excuses you want,,but the REAL FACT is this,,,,we are being forced to throw away food that could with the use of aid money be transported and distributed to starving africans,,we manage to ship enough food from the other side of the world to fill our own bellies.

ask those starving africans which they want.....injections or food.

the EU is killing these people,,but zats vot hitler vanted in ze fost place.


what people throw away food whilst others starve,,,inhumane people thats who.

shirina,,,stop making excuses

Call it what you will, it doesn't change reality. The profit motive drives these folks, not altruism.

Also call me inhumane if you wish, but there is a problem with overpopulation in these areas and THAT has to stop before we can truly help these people. Until they become self-sufficient, the reality is that the more we feed them, the more kids they have, which means more food and more money to keep feeding them - on and on it goes until they end up starving despite our aid because we can't starve ourselves in the process. Something has to be done to override their culture that promotes having boatloads of kids in a region that can barely support mothers having a single child. If you want to know what's REALLY inhumane, it's these women who keep popping out 9 or 10 or 15 kids knowing all but one or two will starve to death. To me, that is willful murder.

well with the attitudes im getting on here,,i dont know why you all dont vote BNP .

most of you would OBVIOUSLY rather all these black people die than a single white one.

most of you know me,,and you know i wouldnt batter an eyelid if tommorow i awoke and their wasnt a single black african left on earth,,the thing is i never knew you were all so like minded...no wonder i got let back on.

mind you i shouldnt be so hard on the EU,,being an animal lover keen carp angler and bird lover,,it's good to know that the EU is doing all it can to feed the vultures in africa,,whom i suspect relish the odd time they come across a zebra carcass

Edited to remove unsavoury content. Ivan.

".... there is a problem with overpopulation in these areas...."

Mother Nature does not recognise overpopulation as a problem. In times of War and/or Famine, the birthrate inevitably increases.

There are always those who find the nature of humanity not entirely to their taste, but the principal purpose of people is to produce more people. Get used to it!

Nin, I know not where in this sad UK you are, but in the early 60s us kids had our arms tied up our backs to put £1 in the collection tray at Sunday School. A lot of money then, nearly half of what I got from my paper round. OH we were all move to tears with the stories from the missionaries (Church of Scotland) who came back with the horror stories of what was happening to "Children just like you!"

That money has not stopped pouring in! people are still hungry and thirsty
People are STILL bequeathing their estates! The politicians in those countries have their private Gulfstream Jets >>>>> LINK <<<<<<<

"Lord Ashcroft, a top House of Lords peer from British Prime Minister David Cameron’s Conservative Party, has allegedly accused President Yoweri Kaguta Museveni of misusing a whopping £30million [approx 117billion shillings] worth of British poverty eradication or development aid money to Uganda to buy himself a Gulf Stream presidential jet."

AND note this is JUNE this very year of our LORD 2011 ad!!!!

If the African politicians and hierarchy don't give a stuff, why the hell should I???????

This has been an ongoing story since Rhodes strolled in that land - the basket of Africa,

Independence has done the PEOPLE of these countries NO favours at all. AND how I or any one else feels about it ain't gonna change a thing.

I care but after 50 and more years am suffering "Shell shock"

NIN/throbbo wrote:-
no wonder i got let back on

You were “let back on” inadvertently, because I send lots of e-mails to people who post on forums, and I wrote to one of the many e-adds you use to avoid detection, not knowing that it belonged to the person who plastered our old forum with childish filth back in May.

Being a liberal (with a very small ‘l’) at heart, I decided to give you a second chance, and as I said yesterday, you are on probation. You have a choice – you can either express your views in reasonable terms, like every other poster on this forum does most of the time, or you’ll leave us with no option but to show you the door. You’re drinking in the last chance saloon.

most of you would OBVIOUSLY rather all these black people die than a single white one.

Oh knock it off with the accusations of racism, NIN. Argue against what I said, not what I DIDN'T say nor intended to say. I refuse to be baited into one of your strawman accusations.

TRUTH HURTS YOU doesnt it?.

You all pretend to be nice people, but in reality you are as evil as any nazi,,a racist isnt someone who calls a black person a "nigger",,oh no a racist is someone who doesnt care when the blck people are starved to death.

which makes all of you who dont care,,or take the theres nowt i can do about it,,rules are rules view,,,more racist than i am.

OK HOT SHOT!!



What are YOU doin' aboot it?


Tis yer thread'n'all! calling us a bunch of well ---------------- you just have to be doing something for them. Right?

ME I'm doin' no more, I've paid for enough Lear jets!! and Camoron does not send ANY moneys there in my name!

Well thats easy,,i am fighting their corner which is more than you as you appear at ease with the fact that food that could feed starving black people is been needlessly thrown away,i just want to show you all your own evil racist reflections.

a real racist isnt someone who calls a black person the N word,,a real racist is someone who doesnt care when other races suffer and die through starvation and the gas chambers,,,those types are real racists.And i see most of you dont REALLY care and are quite happy with things as they are.

You've been on the loopey juice obviously!


Take some Alka Seltzer and go to Ba Bas!



Night All

EDIT
Nin read the link, we send the cash, the politicos but the Grumman Gulf Stream Aircraft. Now shout at the Americans for selling the Aircraft in the first place and using British Aid moneys. Or shout at the politicos who have no intention of helping people who are not of their own tribe.


AH YESSSSSSSSSSS How remisssss of meeeeeeeeeeee Being Black, they cannot be racist, right?

I've had it, wishing yer well.

I dont drink,,no need too as i sleep well at night knowing at least i care more about black people than you lot do.


John barnes said the other week,,we need to take a long hard real look at what racism really is, because at the end of the day name calling is just name calling....looks like he is right.

As Ruuud Gullett said when managing Newcastle United, "I AM BLACK!! I AM illegitamate, where's the insult?

Racism appears in many forms,,even ignorance ,compliance and acceptance.

and people should not be so quick to tar others for being racist fascist bigots without finding out first whether they themselves are.

Astra

I assume that your from the east coast of Scotland, until the early 1960s the herring season used to begin off the Moray Firth and the season then moved south ending normaly at Lowestoft.

The trawlers from the east coast ports scooped up the herring on an industrial scale, the fish markets of Peterhead, South Shields, Hull and in my home town used to be knee deep in herring, and eventualy someone decided that the humble herring was nearing extinction in the North Sea, and oh how the fishermen protested.

Yes there were a few foreign boats that followed the "silver darlings" mostly Dutch, the dutch fishermen used to go up the 199 steps to the parish Church on the cliff in Whitby every Sunday morning, they were quite religious, they also used to eat the herring - raw.

Before the advent of the steam trawlers most fishing was inshore fishing, and here on the Yorkshire coast that meant "Cobles" - long lines in winter and salmon or crabs and lobster in summer, people earned a living, earned a wage, and it was sustainable.

when will they ever learn

NIN/throbbo wrote:-
a racist isnt someone who calls a black person a "nigger"

Yes it is, and it’s also illegal.

i sleep well at night knowing at least i care more about black people than you lot do.

A strange remark from someone who previously said:-

most of you know me,,and you know i wouldnt batter an eyelid if tommorow i awoke and their wasnt a single black african left on earth

I see that the e-address that you used to join Cutting Edge is on a banned list which I received from the administrator of another forum (some of us compare notes). If you like posting on forums, you should tread carefully here, as there might not be many other places which will accept you. As I said earlier, you’re drinking in the last chance saloon.

Well since i havent been on any other forums at all,,except this and msn and your old one (which got closed down in what appear to be very dubious reasons) oh and the daily mail(but i doubt they find anything i say offensive) and the only one i ever got banned from was yours,,perhaps you sent it to yourself?..

Asfor my remark,,it doesnt matter that i wouldnt batter an eyelid, only that i am disgusted with the waste and the hunger and needless death,,and see a solution unlike those who are just quite happy to ignore the fact that food fills starving bellies and shouldnt be thrown away, especially when millions are starving to death,,i bet i would make more black african friends than you.

.... food fills starving bellies and shouldnt be thrown away, especially when millions are starving to death,,i bet i would make more black african friends than you.

I'm told that "black africans" prize what they call Long Pig.

You're welcome.

TRUTH HURTS YOU doesnt it?.

LOL! No, not at all. People lying, however, that's another story altogether. You don't even interest me as a person capable of rational discussion. You came here with a conclusion already prepared and are now baiting people into proving it for you. Your objective is ridiculously transparent. A few more responses and I predict you'll go ballistic and the Last Chance Saloon will be announcing last call very soon. You better nurse that drink, my friend.

-Wow no wonder your last site got closed down( in very dubious and suspicious circumstances).

And please stop with the threats as this site is most likely being monitored and i have broken no site rules,,i appear to have hit a nerve, you are a lunatic if you cannot accept the fact that food that is thrown away because of a rule written by a german will feed the starving in africa,,and an evil racist for not caring about that fact and subscribing or tolerating the system that allows it.

YOU personally subscride to the notion that THEY shouldnt even be allowed to have children,,whilst YOU and YOURS are.,,,,,how racist is that?

it's like a twisted kind of genocide.

When someone shows us our true ugliness we tend to turn away

YOU personally subscride to the notion that THEY shouldnt even be allowed to have children,,whilst YOU and YOURS are.,,,,,how racist is that?

If it had anything whatsoever to do with racism, my twisted and misguided friend, I would be advocating that people of African decent in our own nation be limited in the number of children they have. Except I'm not advocating that, nor can you claim that I have, which sends your poorly aimed accusation sailing right out the window.

I'd also point out, as I have in another thread, that it only took 12 years to add another billion people to this planet. To put that into perspective, it took 127 years to go from 1 billion to 2 billion, but only 33 years to go from two billion to three billion - despite two world wars in that time frame. It took 14 years to from three billion to four billion, 13 years to go from four billion to five billion, 12 years to go from five billion to six billion, and another 12 years to go from six billion to seven billion.

And can you take a wild effing guess where the largest population increases are occurring? I'll even help you along - no, it's not in China or India. Give up? Why, it's in Africa, of course! But not in more advanced areas like South Africa or Egypt. Of course not! The largest population growth is occurring in dirt poor nations that have non-stop issues with famines, diseases, etc. You know, tropical rain forests, loads of bacteria in the water, a plethora of poisonous animals, and some of the worst farming soil to be found outside of a desert. But hey, you just want them to keep having those kiddies until just one mother gives birth to enough babies to personally populate a small town - and with absolutely no forethought to how those kids will even be fed, much less clothed, educated, and medically treated.

You want to turn this into a racist issue, but it's not. It's a demographic issue. Look at a bloody population growth map, for crying out loud. It's not my fault that the problem is in Africa nor am I going to ignore the problem just because I'm not African - or be cowed into remaining silent because someone like you wants to transmorgrify this issue into a racist one. If that map showed Britain to have massive uncontrolled population growth, I'd be pointing my finger straight at you. But that's not the case, now, is it. So we can stop with this racism nonsense because I'm not buying it, and I'm fairly certain no one else is, either.

And, for your information, NIN, I'm only one-quarter White.

Oh, and for your viewing pleasure (not to mention education):

Pure evil racism shirina..Hitler would have been proud of you,,thats a nice picture of the globe,,what is it a paint by numbers?.

and as for you not advocating that black british/american people have no babies,,well you arent advocating it YET.


Just because YOU think youre not a racist,,doesnt mean YOU arent.


mmmmmmm,,,so let me get this right,,you are not going to ignore the fact that there are too many black people on earth, instead you are quite happy to go along with the mass starvation of a few million every year, and if things were down to you,,not only would they be allowed to starve to death,,but you would also take from them their god given right to have children too,,,,and you still reckon that's not racist.

It's time to expose the worlds real racists.

NIN/throbbo. So what's your explanation for why our forum with ProBoards was closed down? Not enough BNP racists there to trash it, as you tried to do with your childish behaviour on Monday 9th May (yes, it's all logged)? If you bothered to follow the link to the review board, you would see that it was closed down - along with two other forums - because a lazy staff member at ProBoards couldn't be bothered to separate the wheat from the chaff.

I don't think we need any lectures on racism from a supporter of the most racist party in the UK, and what's this obsession with Hitler? Some members of your party love him, and their only regret is that he was a foreigner.

Most members of this forum come here to discuss issues in a civilised manner, and you seem determined to spoil that. It's no wonder that the other anti-EU party, UKIP, is seven times more popular (according to YouGov) than the BNP, if you are the best it has to offer. Maybe you're just a troll and you'll get your short-term kicks from wasting our time until we lose patience and show you the door.

Many administrators would have deleted your account immediately once your true identity was revealed, but I decided to give you a chance to express your views in a reasonable manner. I'm beginning to regret that now.

i am discussing in a civilized manner i have broken no rules,,and if you re-read the thread you will notice i am not the one with a nasty and defensive attitude, i dont really care why your last site closed down, neither do you, ut if i were to put my money on a reason,,it would be because you ban anyone who says something you dont like,,then bang on about debate and discussion,,which you yourself by banning people who you dont like their views of,,is kinda defeating the whole reason for a discussion boards existence.

as for hitler,,,find me a photo of nick griffin dressed as a nazi,,,i will find you one of ed balls,,,the most racist politial parties in the uk are pro-european parties as they subscribe to a system that forces 100's of millions of people to throw away good healthy food,,whilst at the same time starving 10's of millions of people from the other side of the world.

ps,,,i will be voting ukip at the next elections,,,so that puts a firecracker up your backside,,like i said i am a floating voter,,,not as easy to brainwash me as it is you,,,have you ever voted anything other than labour?,,,no i bet you havent.

you cannot even accept your own racsim,,i dont blame you,,as you are most likely as ignorant of it as shirina was,,however once she was shown her racism,,as you can see by her posts,,she is quite happy and accepting of it.

Also Ivan i cannot for the life of me believe you have any regrets as there appears to be more passion and debate on this one thread,,than all the others put together,,what exactly do you get on the other threads?

pheonix one copy/pasting...wow,,i wish i could do that instead of just speaking my mind.

and then there is you and witchy and co,,,to whom there is no point debating with each other as you just agree with one another.

if ou want this site just for left leaning lunatics, who believe they are always right whilst everyone else is wrong.

perhaps you should explain that a little more clearly in the site rules.

Imagine all that effort put to some useful purpose ....