Are the Tories velvet glove fascists?

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In my opinion, the UK under our extreme right-wing government is rapidly degenerating into velvet glove fascism.

Like all fascists, Hitler was against trade unions and socialists. Similarly, Michael Gove vilified primary school teachers and dinner ladies, many of whom went on strike for the first time in their lives on 30 November last year, as “militants itching for a fight”. Gove has plans for military cadets in every school (Cameron Youth?) and a return to children sitting in rows reciting lists of kings and queens in history lessons, rather than learning to think. Hitler also realised how important history was to indoctrination when he ordered the mass burning of books. Tories close libraries.

Hitler made sure that he controlled the media. The Tories have cowed the BBC by threats of fragmentation and sharing the licence fee with others, such as Murdoch. The BBC, which was required to be impartial, has become just another mouthpiece for Tory propaganda. As soon as they came to power in 2010, the Tories instructed every minister to repeat over and over again the whopping lie that Labour, not Tory bankers, caused the global credit crisis. We have the repeated lie about everyone in the public sector getting “gold-plated pensions”, when the average is only £5,600 per annum. As Goebbels said: "If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." Cameron has proved over and over again that he’s a pathological liar.

Hitler divided and ruled the German people by scapegoating Jews and gypsies. The Tories are demonising those who receive benefits, one result of which is that disability hate crimes are increasing. Duncan Smith went on breakfast television on 27 May 2010 and made the chilling remark: "Work makes you free". That's an exact translation of the sign which used to hang over the entrances to concentration camps.

The Tories have plans to force 50,000 disabled youth to work for companies such as Sainsbury's and Tesco's unpaid. Cancer patients are being made to undergo work assessments while being treated with chemotherapy, and wounded soldiers are being sacked. (Osborne is willing to take money from the disabled and cancer patients, but not prepared to veto Hester's bonus from the largely state-owned RBS.)

The police are being trained to shoot people with rubber bullets and will be issued with water cannon, yet the Tories were so keen on helping Arab rebels in North Africa. Two unknown Scottish teenagers made a joke on 'Facebook' about organising riots, and they both received four years in jail. A prominent Tory TV presenter (and personal friend of Cameron) made a tasteless joke about murdering trade unionists on prime time television; nothing was done about it and the BBC continue to pay him £1 million a year of our money.

We don't have any concentration camps in the UK, but the principles are the same - propaganda, indoctrination, and divide and rule by demonising a section of the population. While Hitler gassed Jews, the Tories clearly don't care if benefit claimants starve to death. Even payments from the Social Fund, for those in the most desperate need, will no longer be available from job centres but will be at the 'discretion' of local councils, who will not have to ring-fence the money. All the ingredients of fascism are there, but it's just being handed out to us in a more genteel form than Hitler used - in velvet gloves.

Tosh wrote:I have no qualms about building affordable homes as long as they are limited in bedroom size and cannot be purchased.

If people want 6 kids and a 4 bedromm house then they must afford it themselves.

Tosh, I swear you get a big kick out of coming across as a twat. I mean that.

Ivanhoe wrote:

Tosh wrote:I have no qualms about building affordable homes as long as they are limited in bedroom size and cannot be purchased.

If people want 6 kids and a 4 bedromm house then they must afford it themselves.

Tosh, I swear you get a big kick out of coming across as a twat. I mean that.

Tosh is one of those people that thinks the world revolves around him, but then again Ivanhow I think you got it right.

Redflag wrote:

Ivanhoe wrote:

Tosh wrote:I have no qualms about building affordable homes as long as they are limited in bedroom size and cannot be purchased.

If people want 6 kids and a 4 bedromm house then they must afford it themselves.

Tosh, I swear you get a big kick out of coming across as a twat. I mean that.

Tosh is one of those people that thinks the world revolves around him, but then again Ivanhow I think you got it right.

Tosh and his ilk remind me of the Nazi's. They would'nt be told, either.

Tosh and his ilk are arrogant and they love it.

Ivanhoe said: Tosh, I swear you get a big kick out of coming across as a twat. I mean that

I think Tosh is a wind up merchant, and writes the crap he does for no other reason, than for the response you so readily give.

You keep feeding, the greedy little ape will keep eating.

Yup I agree. He's a troll, he gets his kicks out of winding people up. It's a rather sad way to spend ones time I find...

I have no problem with someone like Tosh having his or her opinions, but it would be nice if they could back up those opinions with reasoned statements or reasoned debate. It seems the reason for some comments are designed to upset and annoy rather than discuss and or influence opinion

Agreed! The internet is one big melting pot, but with Tosh either his brain liquified or his arse got burned, coz summat sure did turn him into a contrary mary! lol

Shock Jocks are two a penny...

Adele Carlyon wrote:Agreed! The internet is one big melting pot, but with Tosh either his brain liquified or his arse got burned, coz summat sure did turn him into a contrary mary! lol

Shock Jocks are two a penny...

And right now he is loving all this attention.

And right now he is loving all this attention..

Therefore, let's return to talking about how the Tories seem to be embracing fascism more and more.

So if a public sector worker gets made redundant (and up to a million of them are) and his wife happens to be a few months into a pregnancy at the time, does the latest Tory plan mean that they will get no benefits for the child when it's born? What's next - the compulsory wearing of arm bands by all the unemployed, so that others can vilify them as 'scroungers'?

If the sadistic, fascist Tories are going to make people homeless - and they are, will they at least be civilised enough to provide ample sized cardboard boxes and blankets.

Be wary if they offer you a ride to a free shower room though.....you might fall asleep and never wake up.

Are the Tories velvet glove fascists?


Now might be the appropriate time to acknowledge that the gloves are off.

This is a government at War with its people.

I have forthright views, views shared by a sizeable portion of our nation, I respond in kind, if that makes me a troll then I suggest you look in the mirror. I am entitled to question your criticism of government policy and intention, in effect I am defending the status quo. You do not like people who actually think about policies, whether they are good or bad regardless of the party.

Cameron is a politician, and political change is about opportunity and timing, the British public knew the benefit system needed overhaul during the Labour boom years. It didn't bother us too much when the economy was booming, but its not booming, it has flatlined and this tips the scales.

Now the hard working public do resent a benefit claimant sharing their lifestyle, and Cameron is seizing the deficit as a perfect opportunity to make the radical changes Blair should have carried out.
Bankers fraud and Toffs corruption are lacking in social responsibility, but so are those who choose not to work for next to nothing. What do they mean by work for nothing, the benefit system is not an employer, since when did working become a lifestyle choice ? Isn't it a bit unfair that the person who chooses to contribute to society at no small sacrifice, pays for the people who have no social responsibility at all ?

I would have preferred all these changes to have been implemeted by Blair when cash and jobs were abundant, but there was no public will, now there is.

It's come to something hasn't it when they now attempt to turn people who work and claim benefits against those who haven't got a job. What kind of people fall for such venomous spite? It's appalling!

Your views are your entitlement. The way you sneer and goad people is not something you're entitled to! And people can see straight through your pap!

oftenwrong wrote:Are the Tories velvet glove fascists?


Now might be the appropriate time to acknowledge that the gloves are off.

This is a government at War with its people.

With some of it's people...mainly the ones who are already struggling. What a set of monsters they are!

Divide and Rule.

Not what you might call a new idea. The phrase is attributed to Philip II, king of Macedon (382-336 BC), describing his policy toward the Greek city-states

I want a bit of unite and fook um for a change!

The way you sneer and goad people is not something you're entitled to! And people can see straight through your pap! .

I am entitled to respond in kind, I never said I was a pacifist, I am quite happy to debate content.

I found his reasoning against the mansion tax flawed, the biggest beneficiares of casino banking and lending criteria were homeowners. Since it was these instruments that caused the recession I believe those who benefitted most should give some back to society, to say they worked for all of it is nonsense, house prices doubled and trebled in a decade without a fresh lick of paint.

Tosh wrote:

The way you sneer and goad people is not something you're entitled to! And people can see straight through your pap! .

I am entitled to respond in kind, I never said I was a pacifist, I am quite happy to debate content.

I found his reasoning against the mansion tax flawed, the biggest beneficiares of casino banking and lending criteria were homeowners. Since it was these instruments that caused the recession I believe those who benefitted most should give some back to society, to say they worked for all of it is nonsense, house prices doubled and trebled in a decade without a fresh lick of paint.

.....and that is a primary reason for the welfare benefit bill being so large. Housing benefit payments rocketed in parallel with property prices soaring.

It's more than ironic that all the ignorant, and selfish, Daily Mail type tory middle classes who could be heard boasting gleefully 'we made £100,000 on the house in 3yrs', etc a few years back, are now demanding/supporting cuts in housing benefit. It was a their greed that led to higher rents and thus neccesarily higher housing benefit payments. They are whinging about those claiming the benefits when it was they themselves who put people in the position where they had to claim housing benefit.

In a developed, and supposedly civilised, country you would imagine a roof over ones head would be a basic civil right, and an unquestioned priority of government to ensure that is the case. The tories clearly don't think it is.

Well said SC!

If a person has nowhere to live where they feel safe and secure, then they have nothing at all. Their life becomes nothing but depsair and misery. Why is it apparently ok that so many people have to live a life that plain sucks?

Adele Carlyon wrote:Well said SC!

If a person has nowhere to live where they feel safe and secure, then they have nothing at all. Their life becomes nothing but depsair and misery. Why is it apparently ok that so many people have to live a life that plain sucks?

The apparent mindset of many people in this country is very worrying, Adele. The fact is many people appear willing to fall for Tory propaganda and not only blame the poorest and their children but also have a bloodlust to punish them. It's really quite sickening.

It is! And the last time I saw anything like this was when Thatcher got in! Only this time it's more cruel and sickening, because this is Thatchers generation. That's why it's so much worse. She told everyone it was their duty to not give a shit about anything only number 1!

I have forthright views, views shared by a sizeable portion of our nation, I respond in kind, if that makes me a troll then I suggest you look in the mirror. I am entitled to question your criticism of government policy and intention, in effect I am defending the status quo. You do not like people who actually think about policies, whether they are good or bad regardless of the party.

Cameron is a politician, and political change is about opportunity and timing, the British public knew the benefit system needed overhaul during the Labour boom years. It didn't bother us too much when the economy was booming, but its not booming, it has flatlined and this tips the scales.

Now the hard working public do resent a benefit claimant sharing their lifestyle, and Cameron is seizing the deficit as a perfect opportunity to make the radical changes Blair should have carried out.
Bankers fraud and Toffs corruption are lacking in social responsibility, but so are those who choose not to work for next to nothing. What do they mean by work for nothing, the benefit system is not an employer, since when did working become a lifestyle choice ? Isn't it a bit unfair that the person who chooses to contribute to society at no small sacrifice, pays for the people who have no social responsibility at all ?

I would have preferred all these changes to have been implemeted by Blair when cash and jobs were abundant, but there was no public will, now there is

That's more like it Tosh...all good points well made

It always says a lot to me when the same people harping on about the Toies being the nasty party and velvet gloved facists, were strangely quiet during New Labour years when the top rate of tax was less than the coalition have it at now, left the banks to self regulate and embraced capitalism and all its financial trappings.

They also went on a massive spending spree during the boom years and carried on borrowing despite racking in huge amounts in tax revenue.

This is why I cannot take many posters here seriously. If they really do think the Tories are so bad, then by definition they should also think the same for Labour.......Strangely though this is not the case even though serious tax avoidance was going on all through 13 years of New Labour unchallenged and barely mentioned.

Please convince me this is not the case and I may take you seriously when you complain about the Tories

blue,

The difference is the Tories are deliberately impoverishing people with scant regard for their welfare, or dignity.

sickchip wrote:blue,

The difference is the Tories are deliberately impoverishing people with scant regard for their welfare, or dignity.

We all know that has been there plan from the start even if we had not been in a mess through the bloody bankers, there intension has always been to take us back to Charles Dickens time just waiting for the WORK HOUSES to be built then the Tory party will be as happy as PIGS in SHYTE. But lets us remember what happened in the Poll tax riots those people's children will rise up and put Scam..er..on and his dick heads back in there boxes and it will not be the Unions calling for a general strike it will be the people of the UK will be saying ENOUGH is ENOUGH.

The difference is the Tories are deliberately impoverishing people with scant regard for their welfare, or dignity..

I would suggest the difference is this, if one makes the benefit system or any public sector outfit more efficient then this frees more resources for the impoverished and the deserving. I want those on permanent invalidity or incapacity benefit to be cared for, and one way of doing this when the cupboard is bare is to rid the system of malingerers, those who believe it is dignified to defraud the real sick of their rightful care and support.

There is a world of difference between individual/social responsibility and social Darwinism, the right wing may huff and puff but they will never blow down the altruistic spirit of our culture, it is ingrained in us.

It's more than ironic that all the ignorant, and selfish, Daily Mail type tory middle classes who could be heard boasting gleefully 'we made £100,000 on the house in 3yrs', etc a few years back, are now demanding/supporting cuts in housing benefit. It was a their greed that led to higher rents and thus neccesarily higher housing benefit payments. They are whinging about those claiming the benefits when it was they themselves who put people in the position where they had to claim housing benefit.

In a developed, and supposedly civilised, country you would imagine a roof over ones head would be a basic civil right, and an unquestioned priority of government to ensure that is the case. The tories clearly don't think it is..

I must point out that Labour sat back and allowed the housing bubble to grow and grow,you cannot blame homeowners for the housing pyramid scheme. The government of the day should have known it was an usustainable bubble but were more interested in the capital borrowing that was fuelling the service bubble and consumerism.

A ponzi scheme cannot survive without fresh injections of cash, and this means first time buyers, the financial crisis ended their access to affordable mortgages and now we have an unfair relationship between wages and a first home.

Tosh

I must point out that Labour sat back and allowed the housing bubble to grow and grow,you cannot blame homeowners for the housing pyramid scheme. The government of the day should have known it was an usustainable bubble but were more interested in the capital borrowing that was fuelling the service bubble and consumerism.

A ponzi scheme cannot survive without fresh injections of cash, and this means first time buyers, the financial crisis ended their access to affordable mortgages and now we have an unfair relationship between wages and a first home.

Good post.

We all know that has been there plan from the start even if we had not been in a mess through the bloody bankers,

If the financial crash had not happened then austerity measures would not have been necessary, its simple cause and effect. If Labour had saved a bit for a rainy day then austerity would not be required, now we are in the great flood and millions are drowning.

there intension has always been to take us back to Charles Dickens time just waiting for the WORK HOUSES to be built then the Tory party will be as happy as PIGS in SHYTE.

I don't accept this statement bears any resemblance to the truth, and I fail to see the point in it.

sickchip wrote:Tosh

I must point out that Labour sat back and allowed the housing bubble to grow and grow,you cannot blame homeowners for the housing pyramid scheme. The government of the day should have known it was an usustainable bubble but were more interested in the capital borrowing that was fuelling the service bubble and consumerism.

A ponzi scheme cannot survive without fresh injections of cash, and this means first time buyers, the financial crisis ended their access to affordable mortgages and now we have an unfair relationship between wages and a first home.

Good post.

sickchip, the right wing we have had since the 80's including New Labour, are market based, they rely on greed and selfishness to keep them in power.

Tosh wrote:

It's more than ironic that all the ignorant, and selfish, Daily Mail type tory middle classes who could be heard boasting gleefully 'we made £100,000 on the house in 3yrs', etc a few years back, are now demanding/supporting cuts in housing benefit. It was a their greed that led to higher rents and thus neccesarily higher housing benefit payments. They are whinging about those claiming the benefits when it was they themselves who put people in the position where they had to claim housing benefit.

In a developed, and supposedly civilised, country you would imagine a roof over ones head would be a basic civil right, and an unquestioned priority of government to ensure that is the case. The tories clearly don't think it is..

I must point out that Labour sat back and allowed the housing bubble to grow and grow,you cannot blame homeowners for the housing pyramid scheme. The government of the day should have known it was an usustainable bubble but were more interested in the capital borrowing that was fuelling the service bubble and consumerism.

A ponzi scheme cannot survive without fresh injections of cash, and this means first time buyers, the financial crisis ended their access to affordable mortgages and now we have an unfair relationship between wages and a first home.

"A ponzi scheme cannot survive without fresh injections of cash, and this means first time buyers, the financial crisis ended their access to affordable mortgages...."

So what was the source of those "fresh injections of cash", Tosh? It wasn't the Labour Party, was it?

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static.

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static.

But allowing prices to increase completely out of proportion to wage inflation was sheer stupidity - it should have been obvious it would be unsustainable. More controls on house pricing were/are needed. Steady rises in line with wages would have been the sensible route to take - unfortunately greed won out; and now millions of young working people will probably never be able to buy a home.

sickchip wrote:

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static.

But allowing prices to increase completely out of proportion to wage inflation was sheer stupidity - it should have been obvious it would be unsustainable. More controls on house pricing were/are needed. Steady rises in line with wages would have been the sensible route to take - unfortunately greed won out; and now millions of young working people will probably never be able to buy a home.

Oh dear oh dear. The reason house prices have risen over the decades, is because of the publics obession with making a profit when buying and selling.

We dont have "homes" in this country, we have "properties". The free -market has kept wages for the poorest people low, while house prices have risen as they have.

The totally unbridled free market since the 80's over 30 years ago in housing and everything, has helped keep the poor poor, and the rich rich.

Ivanhoe wrote:

sickchip wrote:

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static.

But allowing prices to increase completely out of proportion to wage inflation was sheer stupidity - it should have been obvious it would be unsustainable. More controls on house pricing were/are needed. Steady rises in line with wages would have been the sensible route to take - unfortunately greed won out; and now millions of young working people will probably never be able to buy a home.

Oh dear oh dear. The reason house prices have risen over the decades, is because of the publics obession with making a profit when buying and selling.

We dont have "homes" in this country, we have "properties". The free -market has kept wages for the poorest people low, while house prices have risen as they have.

The totally unbridled free market since the 80's over 30 years ago in housing and everything, has helped keep the poor poor, and the rich rich.

A good summary Ivanhoe and very true to boot.

Redflag wrote:

Ivanhoe wrote:

sickchip wrote:

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static.

But allowing prices to increase completely out of proportion to wage inflation was sheer stupidity - it should have been obvious it would be unsustainable. More controls on house pricing were/are needed. Steady rises in line with wages would have been the sensible route to take - unfortunately greed won out; and now millions of young working people will probably never be able to buy a home.

Oh dear oh dear. The reason house prices have risen over the decades, is because of the publics obession with making a profit when buying and selling.

We dont have "homes" in this country, we have "properties". The free -market has kept wages for the poorest people low, while house prices have risen as they have.

The totally unbridled free market since the 80's over 30 years ago in housing and everything, has helped keep the poor poor, and the rich rich.

A good summary Ivanhoe and very true to boot.

I hope to god Ed Milliband gets to grips with this if he gains power at the next G/E ?. Britain needs as sure as fresh air, a universial council house building programme from the top down, this would cut out nymbism, and put thousands of tradesmen to work.

So what was the source of those "fresh injections of cash", Tosh? It wasn't the Labour Party, was it?

The government bears fiscal responsibility, well it did until some yo-yo freed the BoE to join in on the jamboree instead of regulating the financial madness that consumed this country for a decade.

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static..

Pardon ? Let me explain something pretty basic, banks only make money out of debt interest, the last thng they want is their loans paid back, they would go bust. As it was they went bust loaning out too much to risky creditors and we the tax payer picked up the tab.....under Labour's watch.

The growth in this country's economy was not real, it was a debt bubble built on the back of artificially low interest rates, you could almost call it private Keynesian.

Tosh wrote:

So what was the source of those "fresh injections of cash", Tosh? It wasn't the Labour Party, was it?

The government bears fiscal responsibility, well it did until some yo-yo freed the BoE to join in on the jamboree instead of regulating the financial madness that consumed this country for a decade.

The reason that average house prices have trebled since 1995 is that the Banks want to get their loans paid back. That couldn't happen if the price of a house was static..

Pardon ? Let me explain something pretty basic, banks only make money out of debt interest, the last thng they want is their loans paid back, they would go bust. As it was they went bust loaning out too much to risky creditors and we the tax payer picked up the tab.....under Labour's watch.

The growth in this country's economy was not real, it was a debt bubble built on the back of low interest rates, you could almost call it Keynesian.

Tosh, if by Labour, you mean "New" Labour" ?. They had literally embraced Thatcher's free market from 1997 to 2010, hence they lost their core voters at the 2010 general election, hence losing the 2010 general elecltion, hence us all ending up with this dreadful coalition.

Ivanhoe said: "Oh dear oh dear. The reason house prices have risen over the decades, is because of the publics obession with making a profit when buying and selling."

Or could it be with the publics obsession to own a property irrespective of if they can afford it or not. Hence the removal of the housing safety net with the selling off of most Council house stocks.

How many of those Council \houses where sold to people who couldn't afford them and ended up having them repossessed and ending up homeless.

What this evil Government now wants is for some more Council/housing Association homes built, only to then be purchased by the tenants many of who in reality will not be able to afford them, and the cycle starts again.Homes should only be owned by those who have the ability to buy them. And the Councils should build and keep their stock of affordable housing for those who can not afford to buy. When you where young and earning peanuts, you don’t go out and buy a Rolls Royce on Hire Purchase, yet these people seem to think it’s a right to own their home.

Tosh, if by Labour, you mean "New" Labour" ?.

I mean the Labour party, the one the electorate voted 3 times to govern them. you can call them anything you want but in 1997, 2001 and 2005 their policies appealed to the majority.

I hate to remind you but the last time this country wanted Old Labour policies was nearly 40 years ago, there may be a good reason for this if you just think about it.

David Cameron is as about as right wing as Tony Blair, the left want another boogy man to attack to justify their archaic policies. If the public didn't want the left after Thatcher then they don't want the left period.

I am afraid you are dinosaurs, unaware of your own impending extinction, you can keep the nutters on the right wing for company, you two deserve each other.

yet these people seem to think it’s a right to own their home..

mmm, I believe everyone should have the right to own their own home if they can afford it. It was the government's job to ensure the mortgage sector was not selling mortgages to people who could not afford it. Labour failed to regulate the housing market, nothing to do with Toffs, Tories, Rachman or the Illuminati.