Does any religion matter at all today?
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Does any religion matter at all today?
by Stox 16 Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:35 am
First topic message reminder :
I will be interested to read peoples thoughts on this question. Does any Religion matter at all today?
I cannot see that any religious church's or anything religious even matters today at all. The only true religion I have ever come across is, Money, Political Power, Land, and greed. all the things we are told they are against, this goes for all religions too in my view.
in fact all the faiths I have come across use all of the tools of money, political power, Land and greed to re-force there religious views on there followers. i have never come across any religion that does not use at least one of this tools to enforce there religious views on the people they are said to be looking after.
I have read over the years all the religious books i can find, and have yet too be moved by any of them. some have very good stories that have something in them for every reader. but their it ends for me. maybe someone can explain why any of this is so important today? as i cannot find anything within the books that states this is very important today or in the past. I myself have come to believe that religion has more to do with the thought of death or dying and the human need to believe that life goes on after death.
However, when we was all born we did not feel pain or come into being with some religious thought in our heads or a book in our hands did we? in fact we had know idea about religion at all? so only find out what religion we are when someone tells us that this is our religion? yet you would think we would all know this already if there was a god? So we only find out what our religion is after birth? or do you believe you know what you religion was before birth? (i did not) if someone told me i was a follower of Islam, I would of said OK at five years old. in fact they could of given me any religion and i would of said fine.
So religion seems to me, religion only matters a get deal more the older you get? so I am told, well if so its failing on me badly. so anyway, it matter more as you get closer to death then? so is this more to do with our human need for life to go on somehow? as we find it hard to believe that life comes to an end and we go into darkness of no mans land? just like before we was born?
I was told at about 6 years old by my mother that this was my faith. but in total truth my mother could of said any faith was my religion and i would of gone along with what she said. To me that was it, Its that simple then. i did not then think about anything religious till i was in the Army in standing in a street in the middle of green line in a war zone in the Lebanon. with both Christains killing, Muslims Killing, Catholic Maronite's Killing, Druze faith Killing, Jewish killing. at first wondering why they was all doing this? not for religion or faith but power and using religion to justify there actions. I remember thinking. just suppose these people had been given a different religion by there mothers. they would instead of killing as a Maronite gunman they would of been killing Maronite's as a Druze gunman?
So your religion is picked for you in my view and some even change it too. yet you would think if you know your god at your death. you should know who you god is before birth? but we do not. So does any of this really matter any more?
well i well be interrested to read your thought on this. its not about any one religion but all of them.
I will be interested to read peoples thoughts on this question. Does any Religion matter at all today?
I cannot see that any religious church's or anything religious even matters today at all. The only true religion I have ever come across is, Money, Political Power, Land, and greed. all the things we are told they are against, this goes for all religions too in my view.
in fact all the faiths I have come across use all of the tools of money, political power, Land and greed to re-force there religious views on there followers. i have never come across any religion that does not use at least one of this tools to enforce there religious views on the people they are said to be looking after.
I have read over the years all the religious books i can find, and have yet too be moved by any of them. some have very good stories that have something in them for every reader. but their it ends for me. maybe someone can explain why any of this is so important today? as i cannot find anything within the books that states this is very important today or in the past. I myself have come to believe that religion has more to do with the thought of death or dying and the human need to believe that life goes on after death.
However, when we was all born we did not feel pain or come into being with some religious thought in our heads or a book in our hands did we? in fact we had know idea about religion at all? so only find out what religion we are when someone tells us that this is our religion? yet you would think we would all know this already if there was a god? So we only find out what our religion is after birth? or do you believe you know what you religion was before birth? (i did not) if someone told me i was a follower of Islam, I would of said OK at five years old. in fact they could of given me any religion and i would of said fine.
So religion seems to me, religion only matters a get deal more the older you get? so I am told, well if so its failing on me badly. so anyway, it matter more as you get closer to death then? so is this more to do with our human need for life to go on somehow? as we find it hard to believe that life comes to an end and we go into darkness of no mans land? just like before we was born?
I was told at about 6 years old by my mother that this was my faith. but in total truth my mother could of said any faith was my religion and i would of gone along with what she said. To me that was it, Its that simple then. i did not then think about anything religious till i was in the Army in standing in a street in the middle of green line in a war zone in the Lebanon. with both Christains killing, Muslims Killing, Catholic Maronite's Killing, Druze faith Killing, Jewish killing. at first wondering why they was all doing this? not for religion or faith but power and using religion to justify there actions. I remember thinking. just suppose these people had been given a different religion by there mothers. they would instead of killing as a Maronite gunman they would of been killing Maronite's as a Druze gunman?
So your religion is picked for you in my view and some even change it too. yet you would think if you know your god at your death. you should know who you god is before birth? but we do not. So does any of this really matter any more?
well i well be interrested to read your thought on this. its not about any one religion but all of them.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Guest Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:24 pm
.
Last edited by RockOnBrother on Mon Apr 22, 2013 4:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:27 pm
Since I’ve been doctrine-free for decades, what “big block of doctrine” might that be?
The one that prevents you saying Yahweh, or do you consider that normal behaviour on your ward ?
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:31 pm
“That must mean” exactly what I’ve said, “Insufficient observational evidence has made my mind up; thus, if and when I am ‘shown the money’, my mind very well may be unmade up. Money talks.”
Thankfully for all concerned, neither reality nor the truth is made up by your mind, but I can show you the way to the nearest nut house where you will be considered a scholar and a gentleman.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by oftenwrong Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:31 pm
Shirina wrote:OW's Law:
Well, I think I've let this go on for far too long.
I think everyone is well aware of your contempt for religious discussions - and perhaps that contempt carries over to the participants as well. No one says you have to participate in these debates, but I would ask that you show some mutual respect for those that do. Obviously, judging from the responses to your posts, people are getting irritated - and I can see why.
After all, I notice you participate in debates/discussions on UK economics - and I don't see folks from the religious threads over there sniping away at the topic itself or the people who post there.
I have read what you have written, Shirina.
The American President who had to authorise the dropping of two atomic bombs on Japan, Harry S. Truman, said at the time, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen."
I shall continue to comment freely on any and all topics on a Public Forum. With the greatest respect to all concerned. Injured parties are equally free to reciprocate on said Public Forum.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Guest Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:34 pm
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Last edited by RockOnBrother on Thu May 02, 2013 3:53 am; edited 2 times in total
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Shirina Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:35 pm
With the greatest respect to all concerned. Injured parties are equally free to reciprocate on said Public Forum.
However eloquently stated, what you just said, essentially, is: "If I want to start a flame war and wreck discussions, that's what I'm gonna do!"
Except that's not what either Ivan or myself wants.
Sure, go ahead and comment freely, but the moment I see the discussion degenerate, I'll have to do something about it. Others here have been censured for sniping, and the rules apply to everyone equally.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:37 pm
I shall continue to comment freely on any and all topics on a Public Forum. With the greatest respect to all concerned. Injured parties are equally free to reciprocate on said Public Forum.
You are quite right you censorious condescending product of macro-evolution, I hope your chromosomes unfuse and you choke on a peanut.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:40 pm
I can’t show you evidence of something about which I know nothing.
Are you suggesting all that Hebrew scholar gibberish was all for nought and you have learned nothing ?
Do you drool, I bet you drool.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Guest Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:49 pm
RockOnBrother wrote:
I don’t have it; I have a conclusion that any hypothesis that posits macro-evolutionary origin of the eye is an unreasonable hypothesis.
Shirina wrote:
Ah, but you do.
“What kinda job I got now?”
Signifying blues - Bo Diddley (1:32-1:48)
http://youtube.googleapis.com/v/TZTsM3VphXY
Shirina wrote:
The fact that you said ANY hypothesis involving macro-evolution is unreasonable…
I didn’t say that. “Read my lips”; I said “that any hypothesis that posits macro-evolutionary origin of the eye is an unreasonable hypothesis.”
RockOnBrother wrote:
And it’s got to be Texas brisket, bar-b-qued slow, closed pit, hickory or mesquite smoked, sauce, if any, on the side.
Shirina wrote:
Unfortunately, I think my landlord would throw a fit if I dug a BBQ pit in the courtyard so you might have to deal with kitchen-prepared brisket, I'm afraid.
Tell your landlord that a Texan commanded that a Bar-b-que pit be dug right smack dab in the center of the courtyard, and by authority granted by the Texas Extra-Territorial Sovereignty Act of 1994, better known as TETSA-94, any failure to comply won’t be taken kindly to by the Texas Ranger at the door.
Last edited by RockOnBrother on Thu May 02, 2013 4:03 am; edited 5 times in total
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:52 pm
Non-macro-evolved eyes for sure.
You are speaking with scientific certainty, ROck. Something you continuously berate others for doing. You have no idea what evidence is available or will be available on the evolution of eyes. I do hope you realise that the entire being in a species is evolving and not just the eyes.
You have eyes, you just won't use them to see.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:56 pm
that any hypothesis that posits the evolutionary origin of the eye is a reasonable hypothesis.
Rock is playing semantics and word games again. Take out the word macro. Is that any better, Rock?
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:59 pm
I'm not sure what use OW is to discussions. He doesn't participate and just seems to try to derail the conversation with inane comments that don't mean anything to the topic. Does he think he's witty or something? The British are generally speaking very witty. Does OW have an extra chromosome?
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:08 pm
I'm not sure what use OW is to discussions.
No man is an island....except maybe Texas.
He doesn't participate and just seems to try to derail the conversation with inane comments that don't mean anything to the topic.
He is not addressing the topic, you may have one more guess.
Does he think he's witty or something?
Is the Pope a Catholic ?
The British are generally speaking very witty.
The British are very snobby, especially the commies.
Does OW have an extra chromosome?
Look anyone who thinks polyglide and Texas are bonkers can't be all bad or mad.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:11 pm
Look anyone who thinks polyglide and Texas are bonkers can't be all bad or mad.
Yeah, but OW's like the pot calling the kettle black.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:16 pm
Yeah, but OW's like the pot calling the kettle black.
I didn't know oftenwrong was black.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Guest Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:18 pm
RockOnBrother wrote:
Non-macro-evolved eyes for sure.
snowyflake wrote:
You are speaking with scientific certainty, Rock. You have eyes, you just won't use them to see.
Nope. My comment applies to the implausibility, not the impossibility, of macro-evolved eyes. And my plausibly non-macro-evolved eyes see “pretty good.”
I apologize for the delay in getting back to you; I was busy being silly.
Signifying blues - Bo Diddley (1;32-1:48)
http://youtube.googleapis.com/v/TZTsM3VphXY
Last edited by RockOnBrother on Thu May 02, 2013 4:04 am; edited 2 times in total
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:28 pm
I was busy being silly.
Its called being a closet creationist, I will get you to come out soon, I do not lack perseverance, but I will throw rotten tomatoes.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Guest Fri Apr 05, 2013 8:47 pm
.
Last edited by RockOnBrother on Thu May 02, 2013 4:11 am; edited 3 times in total
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Fri Apr 05, 2013 9:54 pm
Haven’t seen an eye micro-evolve,
No orientals in Texas, are there ?
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:57 pm
I didn't know oftenwrong was black
He's the pot, Tosh
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by oftenwrong Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:22 am
See how easy it is? Thrust and parry. Argument and counter-argument. A lively exchange of views, and sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
Or people can take in each others' washing for excitement.
Or people can take in each others' washing for excitement.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:52 am
See how easy it is? Thrust and parry. Argument and counter-argument. A lively exchange of views, and sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
You would cause an argument in an empty house with your censorious condescension, try and take a leaf out my book of polite etiquette.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:26 pm
Francis is a bit disturbed eh? Is that you OW?
Is that you OW?
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by oftenwrong Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:28 pm
Only the accent was changed, to avoid problems with the Censor.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by snowyflake Mon Apr 08, 2013 7:03 pm
You're quite a catch, OW
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by polyglide Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:47 pm
Yes Tosh, deformity which would never become dominant.
This is exactly th same as natutal selection, the dominant gene will prevail
and in the case of any human having a deformity it will never be dominant.
I have bred animals for colour, build and behaviour etc., which is easy if you can determine the dominant genes and put them together etc; for that which you are attempting to achieve.
However, there is no chance whatsoever in doing so that you can evolve a complete new species.
This is exactly th same as natutal selection, the dominant gene will prevail
and in the case of any human having a deformity it will never be dominant.
I have bred animals for colour, build and behaviour etc., which is easy if you can determine the dominant genes and put them together etc; for that which you are attempting to achieve.
However, there is no chance whatsoever in doing so that you can evolve a complete new species.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Shirina Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:52 pm
I have bred animals for colour, build and behaviour etc., which is easy if you can determine the dominant genes and put them together etc; for that which you are attempting to achieve.
Wow, you do it the hard way.
If you want spotted goats, for instance, why not just paint spots on the parent goats? The offspring will come out spotted! That's what the Bible says.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by polyglide Tue Apr 09, 2013 5:03 pm
I do not know which Bible you read.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Shirina Tue Apr 09, 2013 5:08 pm
I do not know which Bible you read.
Genesis 30:31-43
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Tue Apr 09, 2013 5:12 pm
Yes Tosh, deformity which would never become dominant.
Not true, it would depend on the environmental pressures, you asked me how and I proved how, genetic mutation.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by polyglide Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:40 pm
Utter nonsense, you would have to have thousands of the same deformity and they mate and produce their like, even this would not produce a new species just a variation, this happens in nature but is not the explanation
for the start of life. If they had three legs, they would just be three legged humans.
You once mentioned being in a wheelchair. if this is so you have my heartfelt sympathy, if you are not then you are just pathetic.
for the start of life. If they had three legs, they would just be three legged humans.
You once mentioned being in a wheelchair. if this is so you have my heartfelt sympathy, if you are not then you are just pathetic.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:28 pm
You stated humans could not evolve 3 eyes and were proven wrong, a whale started off with legs and over time evolved into a new species, proving you wrong again, it is becoming monotonous.
And yes evolution is nothing to do with the start of life, no one is claiming otherwise.
And yes evolution is nothing to do with the start of life, no one is claiming otherwise.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by polyglide Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:40 pm
Any human with three eyes would be as a result of a gene malfunction and would be an isolated case with no prospect of becoming the norm. You find this kind of thing in all animal life and also plant life, none of which prosper.
There is no evidence that a whale having, what you call feet, has ever been without them.
The worl;d is flat.
There is no evidence that a whale having, what you call feet, has ever been without them.
The worl;d is flat.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by polyglide Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:16 pm
I do not know who deletes posts but they should leave ligitimate posts alone.
In reply to the verses quoted in Genisis.
There is no way in which one can say that it is implied that you can paint an animal a colour and it will produce that colour.
The narrative of Leban, Isaac, Jacob and Esau, is partly symbolic and told in a manner that would be understood by the people living at that time.
You can gather this from the ram going to the cattle, an impossibility regarding breeding, the animals referred to as brown, would, if carrying the dominant genes for several colours, would breed those colours.
This has nothing whatsoever to do with my previous post.
In reply to the verses quoted in Genisis.
There is no way in which one can say that it is implied that you can paint an animal a colour and it will produce that colour.
The narrative of Leban, Isaac, Jacob and Esau, is partly symbolic and told in a manner that would be understood by the people living at that time.
You can gather this from the ram going to the cattle, an impossibility regarding breeding, the animals referred to as brown, would, if carrying the dominant genes for several colours, would breed those colours.
This has nothing whatsoever to do with my previous post.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:04 pm
Any human with three eyes would be as a result of a gene malfunction and would be an isolated case with no prospect of becoming the norm. You find this kind of thing in all animal life and also plant life, none of which prosper.
It is a result of genetic variation and the prospect depends on the environment, you are admitting evolution but you just don't realise it.
Last edited by Tosh on Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Shirina Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:09 pm
The narrative of Leban, Isaac, Jacob and Esau, is partly symbolic and told in a manner that would be understood by the people living at that time.
Ah, right. So the verses that are inconveniently ridiculous and scientifically debunked are "partly symbolic" but stories like Adam and Eve are literal history. Gotchya.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by oftenwrong Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:18 pm
We are here on earth to do good unto others.
What the others are here for, I have no idea.
~ W.H. Auden
What the others are here for, I have no idea.
~ W.H. Auden
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by Tosh Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:19 pm
Ah, right. So the verses that are inconveniently ridiculous and scientifically debunked are "partly symbolic" but stories like Adam and Eve are literal history. Gotchya. Wink
Please don't annoy him, he is back on his butterfly mission.
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Re: Does any religion matter at all today?
by oftenwrong Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:39 pm
But if Adam never met Eve, how did we all get here?
The theory that we originated from the eruptions of undersea volcanoes is not flattering, but explains some of the people you meet.
The theory that we originated from the eruptions of undersea volcanoes is not flattering, but explains some of the people you meet.
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» Manufacturing, does it matter?
» Does inequality matter?
» Should religion and politics be separate?
» "People say we need religion, when what they really mean is we need police"
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