To hate Jews is to hate God

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To hate Jews is to hate God.

If you believe in the sacrifice of Jesus, then you must believe that God planned for it and set the conditions even before the earth was formed. If as most believe, the Jews were the cause of the sacrifice, then one must believe that God put the notion and desire to kill Jesus in the Jewish hearts. Jews then were God’s tools in carrying out God’s plan. Jews then should be venerated just as Jesus is because Jesus and Jews were required and caused by God to participate in the sacrifice. They were all doing God’s will and not their own.

Jesus was a Jew and to hate Jews means that Jesus is also hated. The church has historically persecuted Jews and only repented for their actions in 2011 with the pope acknowledging that not all Jews should be hated. Just those directly involved in the sacrifice of Jesus. Ignoring of course that they were charged directly by God to be and do what God wanted.

http://www.christianpost.com/news/jews-not-responsible-for-death-of-christ-pope-says-49267/

Why then have Christians historically hated Jews, and by inference, hate the Jew part of God/Jesus the Jew?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKg4HLsu5gE&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ott15j2KwQ&feature=related

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoHP-f-_F9U

The weird twist to this history is that the Christian right who hates Jews the most, is now the ones pushing for funding of the Jewish homeland to fulfill prophesy.

Most Jews do not believe that Jesus was the messiah. Is the Christian right just funding Jews to help drive them to destruction at the hands of God?

Jews tend not to read the O. T. the way Christians do. Are Christian interpretations of Jewish text superior or inferior to the Jewish interpretation of their own myths?

Regards
DL

All inventions etc; are as a result of past actions etc;

I thought you discounted what has gone before, changed your tune eh ?

However, what the present generations will do with the latest inventions will not depend on what others did with theirs in the past, it will depend entirely on present circumstaneces which are changing daily.

Wanna bet?

If not for WWII, European nations would have fallen upon each other like wolves over the idea of the EU and the controversy it brings - just as European nations have been invading one another for thousands of years. History matters, ESPECIALLY if you're going to discuss global affairs. We are creatures of history, polyglide - it directs and guides our actions both as individuals and as civilizations.

I just wish history had enabled you to understand reality.

it directs and guides our actions both as individuals and as civilizations.

The situation in the MIddle East is entirely based on history and past events. The conflicts between Arabs and Jews has been going on for millennia.

I just wish history had enabled you to understand reality.

Savor the irony ...

I just wish history had enabled you to understand reality.

Fossils are history and fossils scream evolution, but you dismiss this reality because seemingly we cannot know what happened in history.

You are like a spinning top banging off walls and doors, just clueless.

I fear not knowing the ends of space-time. We can’t even know what’s going on in our own solar system. Curiosity is just touching the hem of the garment on what’s happening right now in one tiny corner of Mars, the most known planet, and it can’t see back in time. Jupiter’s interior and Saturn’s interiors are unknowable for the foreseeable future. And past Neptune? Forget it. All we can do is examine from here visible and invisible magnetic waves that started their journeys here at least four point five years ago and up to millions or billions of years ago.

Texas,

You sound like a frustrated " Trekkie " fan, and your solution is to adopt a bronze age explanation of the entire universe.

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Then call it a summation of what I’ve said?

Why?

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Then why call it a summation of what I’ve said?

I've summed up as briefly as possible without preaching or lecturing. You don't believe in death. You said so. So you deny death. You are a death denier or in death denial. You believe the promises that God made to you in the bible, one of those promises is an all inclusive all expenses paid trip to heaven when you die.

No one would believe as strongly as you do if there were no pay off to your belief. If you are saying that you don't believe because the reward is heaven, then please answer the question that I've asked you many times and you dance away from.

Why would you believe in God if the reward is not eternal life?

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You never die; I never die.

To sum up briefly: You deny death.

“I believe in God’s promises, so I can also answer the question, “Why do you believe in God’s promises?” I believe in his promises because he has delivered on his promises to me. He never promised me a rose garden, so I haven’t looked for one. For example, through Y’shua’s apostle, Jesus’ apostle, Paul, he promised me that I can persevere through all things through Moshiach, Christ, who strengthens me.”

God's promised eternal life in heaven with him and Jesus. Without all the deluded intellectuality you attach to your belief the bottom line is eternal life/heaven is the prize.

Why else would you believe? Every believer of any faith believes because they fear eternal damnation. Otherwise you would not believe. You have no reason to believe if the pay off isn't eternal life. To say otherwise is dishonest.

"My Father's mansion has many rooms."

It's going to need them if everyone expecting to go to Heaven when they die is not to suffer a terrible disappointment.

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“As the study of physics continued, I slowly realized design on a macro scale. Just the fact that phenomena like all of the mind-bending aspects of Special and General Relativity can be precisely described mathematically pretty much blew me away.

For example, through Y’shua’s apostle, Jesus’ apostle, Paul, he promised me that I can persevere through all things through Moshiach, Christ, who strengthens me.”

Texas, no need to spam us all into submission, take a deep breath and explain to us victims, what aspects of general relativity enable Paul to make promises on behalf of a dead chap he never had the pleasure of meeting ?


A lifetime of studying and contemplating has caused me to know, " dead men have a limited capacity for conversation ", and nothing in Einstein's theory of relativity alters this knowledge.

Okie Dokie, lets see if I can piece together your little jigsaw and see if it complies with basic logical principles, lets see if your own logic stands the test of logic.

As an atheist you observed nothing in nature that screamed design, then you observe the mathematical regularity and symmetry of gravity and it screams design, and by definition a designer.

Now unless I am mistaken a design is not identified by its regularity or symmetry but by its purpose, a simple trip to Vegas to play the slots demonstrates my point. Your logic dictates the irregular, asymmetric and random slots are not designed, and yet we know this randomness is purposely designed. So logically one cannot KNOW if something is designed or not by its properties, one needs to observe purpose in order to identify design.

I fail to see how one can perceive purpose in gravity alone, one has to expand ones observations beyond gravity to see purpose, and this expansion must incorporate life. And yet for 20 years you as an atheist by definition saw no designed purpose to life or nature.

My logic differs from your logic, since symmetry alone does not scream design, I fail to see how this observation could possibly change your initial conclusion of life's randomness. This suggests your conversion had more to do with purpose than symmetry, at 20 years of age your mind matured and sought purpose, lo and behold the Bible provides purpose, and you sought scholarly reasons for believing in a design and a designer.

Logic dictates one starts with a premise and work toward a logical conclusion, you reversed this process, you started with a fixed conclusion that there is purpose behind life and the Bible is true, and tried to find evidence to logically prove design and a designer.

Unfortunately for your case there is no evidence that proves design, so you fabricate evidence to prove your conclusion is not illogical or irrational, and reject all evidence that contradicts the Bible, the design and the designer in order to protect and defend your chosen purpose.

As I said, its an intellectual sham to avoid stating the obvious, at 20 you needed life to have a special purpose and you went out and found one that made your life meaningful. Some perceive randomness as meaningless, and that was the driving force behind your conversion, nothing to do with relativity or the Big Bang.


I stated earlier there is nothing wrong with you requiring the Bible to give your life meaning and purpose, just don't bullshit me it was a choice born out of scholarly logic.

Mr Spock and David Hume did not believe in God because there was no logic to support it....the defense rests.

To sum up ever so briefly. (at least briefer than your post)

You believe that there is a part of you that never dies. What this part is, you haven't said. You agree that the body dies but you think that some other part, perhaps the 'soul', never dies. You deny absolute death, in spite of the evidence that when your brain dies, you die. You believe that a part of you leaves your body and goes somewhere else. So you deny absolute death.

If you are saying you believe in God for scholarly reasons only (I'm referring to the reams of repetitive posts) you are lying to yourself Rock. You would not believe if the pay off wasn't eternal life. No one would. Take that out of the system and you have no reason to believe, no reason to defend your belief as staunchly as you do. God is going to reward your committment personally by granting you a place in heaven.

Believers believe because the grand prize is a place in heaven and eternal life when you die. Is that true or not as far as you are concerned?

Snowy,

You have just invited Texas to post yet more repetitive spam, you do realize this ?

I intend to lobby the politburo to have all the posts of Texas limited to 14-15 lines, on the grounds the content insults my intelligence.

Hi Tosh

The ONLY reason anyone believes in God is because of the promise of eternal life in heaven wherever or whenever that is. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar. The psychology of belief is NEVER based on intellectual study alone. NO ONE would put that much effort and energy into a belief system if there wasn't a pay off or prize or promise at the end of your life. And the basis of that belief is the fear of death, the 'not being'.

Everything else that is said is meant to make that belief 'sound' like it was purely an intellectual pursuit. Bullshit.

For me to say anything other than the following is dishonest.

It is dishonest to completely ignore the question I asked and obfuscate with utter rubbish that is designed to make your belief sound like an intellectual pursuit when at the heart of it, you are afraid of death and eternal damnation. You believe you will have eternal life because of your belief in God. And you also think, maybe subconsciously, that your defense of the faith pleases God. You are a good Christian.

Just for once, why don't you admit the truth when you are asked?

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You believe that a part of you leaves your body and goes somewhere else.

I can only say - It has been proven that people can come outside their bodies and it is the 'outer body experience' I refer to. What is remarkable is that, simple tests are all thats needed to verify this. No need to wire up an individual and scan the brain while the experience is happening,because usually this results in erroneous conclusions that the brain is creating this so-called illusion.

If it is so that the individual can 'astral travel' shall we say,then surely the existence beyond physical matter is a valid suggestion for valid investigation.

Go well


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I’ve exposed myself to ridicule, derision, and belittlement from you by posting truth.

God is not going to grant you a place in heaven? You are not promised eternal life? This is what you believe? When you die what will happen to your soul? No eternal life, no heaven?

Then my next question would be, What is the point of belief?

I am not ridiculing or belittling you. I'm fed up.

I can only say - It has been proven that people can come outside their bodies and it is the 'outer body experience' I refer to. What is remarkable is that, simple tests are all thats needed to verify this. No need to wire up an individual and scan the brain while the experience is happening,because usually this results in erroneous conclusions that the brain is creating this so-called illusion.

I would very much like to see this proof, Jsmythe, if you care to post a link please.

I would very much like to see this proof, Jsmythe, if you care to post a link please.

Hello Snowy, The original link that was there some years ago has been deleted (surprise surprise). However there are more links and the name is Dr. Charles Tart. I myself saw the experiment in the nineties. I will find the original papers to upload (a friend has copies) so please bear with me.

It is very simple really and it requires the subjects to read cards only accessable from using ladders on a high platform. These cards will have sequences of numbers letters or phrases. The idea being,the subject floats above reading these irtems. Special measures are easy to secure these items from any tampering and any other wrong doinds to the experiment.

Simple enough that some of us can organize similar experiments.

Go well

Do you like poetry ?

I’ve exposed myself to ridicule, derision, and belittlement from you by posting truth.

....no that would be from me, and you deserve it for abusing my good nature, we used to be friends, I bleed just like you.

Do you like poetry ?

I do since being among you lot- I appreciate it much more. Not so good in the verse myself, but I do try.

Simple enough that some of us can organize similar experiments.

Go collect the money.

The James Randi Educational Foundation (JREF) is a non-profit organization founded in 1996 by magician and skeptic James Randi. The JREF's mission includes educating the public and the media on the dangers of accepting unproven claims, and to support research into paranormal claims in controlled scientific experimental conditions.

The organization administers the One Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge, which offers a prize of one million U.S. dollars which it will pay out to anyone who can demonstrate a supernatural or paranormal ability under agreed-upon scientific testing criteria. The JREF also maintains a legal defense fund to assist persons who are attacked as a result of their investigations and criticism of people who make paranormal claims.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Randi_Educational_Foundation

I do since being among you lot- I appreciate it much more. Not so good in the verse myself, but I do try.

I am no longer a member of " you lot ", I blame a woman of course.

Sorry Jsmythe but Charles Tart is a parapsychologist which falls outside mainstream scientific disciplines. There are no papers in scientific journals and I'm willing to bet that no scientific journal worth it's salt would publish anything he has written. He has admittedly written many books but I doubt his 'research' would stand up to scientific scrutiny.

That's just my opinion.

Take care folks. I'm off.

Perhaps I can answer both,Snowy and Tosh at the same time here. Such works no doubt, would now only be in the 'military industrial complex'.
You see they themselves believed 'remote viewing was genuine,such is that they spent billions on it. Ex director in remote viewing (CIA) has done lectures in London. According to him this is a true phenomenon.



Besides - do you know how difficult genuine calls for Randi to test certain promising individuals are? Many never get replies back. Perhaps the money means more to him than ever.

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Besides - do you know how difficult genuine calls for Randi to test certain promissing individuals are ? Many never get relies back.

May I draw your attention to the date the challenge began....1996...that is 17 years and counting.

May I draw your attention to the date the challenge began....1996...that is 17 years and counting.

Yes a long time to 'pick and choose'.After all,he does seem to help (by some ideas) keep up the general charade - ordinary people can not do more than just exist in skin and bone. Religion too,giving us the need for an extra-ordinary to be relied upon or to be worshipped to exist and be happy.

Ridicule, derision, and belittlement from others that post on this forum causes me to mourn for those persons’ minds and those persons’ beings;

Please dismount my friend from your steed of self righteousness, I ridicule your denial of common knowledge taught in every school, I deride your debating style because it is designed to irritate and I belittle your disingenuous attempts to intellectualize " the Bible is literally true because it says it is true ".

On numerous occasions I have respected your belief in God and Jesus, but I refuse to respect your creationism and your literalism, I am joined by all of mainstream Christianity in believing your fundamentalism and pseudo science derides, ridicules and belittles faith. You do a far better job than any atheist in making a mockery of religious belief.

There are 2 billion Christians in the world and less than 15% deny common ancestry, therefore 1.7 billion Christians mourn for your mind and being, because they love you.

Peace.

You see they themselves believed 'remote viewing was genuine,such is that they spent billions on it. Ex director in remote viewing (CIA) has done lectures in London.

Seconded.

What Jsmythe said is true. It was called the "Stargate Project."

CIA-Initiated Remote Viewing At Stanford Research Institute

Finally, a recent unclassified report [23] prepared for the CIA by the American Institutes for Research (AIR), concerning a remote viewing effort carried out under a DIA program called Star Gate (discussed in detail elsewhere in this volume), cites the roles of the CIA and DIA in the history of the program, including acknowledgment that a cadre of full-time government employees used remote viewing techniques to respond to tasking from operational military organizations

Regardless of one's a priori position, however, an unimpassioned observer cannot help but attest to the following fact. Despite the ambiguities inherent in the type of exploration covered in these programs, the integrated results appear to provide unequivocal evidence of a human capacity to access events remote in space and time, however falteringly, by some cognitive process not yet understood.

LINK

It should be pointed out, however, that "remote viewing" is NOT the same thing as an "out of body experience." The ability to remotely view distant places does not indicate that a "soul" ever left the body or that the physical human brain is not responsible for this phenomenon.

In addition, all of the "remote viewers" I have personally heard (many of them keep blogs) have failed utterly to predict anything outside of expected statistical accuracy. Much of what they claim to "see" cannot be proven either way. After all, it's impossible to verify if a crashed UFO in the Russian hinterlands actually exists, for example.

As far as I'm concerned, the jury is still out but leaning heavily toward finding the defendant guilty of nonexistence.