Do the Tories have anything to offer us other than myths and lies?

First topic message reminder :

We were warned two years ago that Cameron is an obnoxious and loathsome individual, but not enough people were listening:-
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/02/04/david-cameron-what-the-experts-say-115875-22017276/

The Tories have nothing to offer to anyone apart the rich.

For the rest it's just poverty and despair.

Please do not think ill of me for what I am about to say, If we get a another Tory gov't it will be down to England listening & beleiving the BLATANT LIES of the Tory party & SNP sorry but I will say HELL SLAP IT INTO YOU ALL and do not come crying to me when the Tories start piling on the cuts to the low paid vulnerable and the rest of us that do not have LOADSA MONEY.

I have said before if the Tories get back into power there will be a REVELUTION within the UK, the 2011 riots where childs play to what will happen this time because it will be adults not just the young that will be up in arms, something the Tories have harped on about "GREECE" you will have all seen the riots there here in the UK will more than likely much the same in the anger stakes.

Redflag, I do believe that having a revolution here in the UK is taking things a little too far, those who will have their benefits cut or maybe even stopped in some cases are going to feel angry,but I do not believe enough to quote Sheakspeare "to take up arms against a sea of troubles".
Mainly because it will not end the troubles called the Tories being in power.

Well, you never know, Stu.  The British electors may have seen right through the Tories' "divide and rule" campaign.   There's certainly an air of desperation in the way they have been carrying on recently.

O.W. my post in answer to Redflags, was to indicate that there would be no revolution in the UK if the tories got back in power, do you think that there would?

Sorry Stuart on this one your wrong the people of the UK are very angry at the moment but the Tories getting back into power would light the blue touch paper. The reason is as soon as Davy boy brings in more cuts to the Welfare & Public services that will be the MATCH that lights the blue touch paper plus the Unions know they will be unable to strike if Davy boy gets his way.

OK Redflg, we will have to see will we not, it is just the thought of riots in my lovely country that I do not like the thought of.

"What a liar our Prime Minister is - just utterly cynical." (Angela Eagle)  


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A Cameron pronouncement is like the English weather.
If you don't like it now, just wait half-an-hour and it will probably have changed.

Anyone that believes what comes out of the gob of Davy boy has lost there marbles OW, I have watched the Parliament channel since 2010 and by God have I learned many a lesson on how to LIE with a straight face the Tories have taught me well but the up side of that is I can spot a Tory LIE from 20 paces.

Redflag wrote:I can spot a Tory LIE from 20 paces.

Not hard, dammo - they do nothing else!

Very true Penderyn but why does the people of the UK not see through there "BARE FACES LIES"

David Cameron won general election with series of lies, says Yvette Cooper

• Cameron denied during the election that he would cut child tax credits. Osborne unveiled £4.5bn of cuts to child tax credits in the budget.

• Cameron said during the election there would be no cuts to child benefit beyond a two-year freeze. Cooper says it will now be subject to a four-year freeze.

• Cancellation of rail electrification plans.

• Downgrading of the number of affordable homes due to be built. The OBR has said 14,000 fewer homes will be built.

• Delaying of a decision on a new airport runway in south-east England.

• Delay in the introduction of tax-free childcare from 2015 to 2017.

• Shelving of an election pledge to give public officials three days off work to take part in volunteering.

• Delay until 2020 in the introduction of the social care cap.

• Reversal of pledge for greater government transparency after launch of review into freedom of information.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/aug/06/david-cameron-won-general-election-with-series-of-lies-says-yvette-cooper

Yvette is quite correct Ivan in fact every time he opens his GOB its just to utter another bloody whopper of a LIE, its about time the people of the UK woke up and smelt the coffee.  Maybe when they see the real cuts to working tax credits come into effect in April 2016 maybe then people will stop sitting on their hands or go around without there rose coloured specs on.

"Jeremy Corbyn is a security risk." So says the coke user featured in this extract from a book by Natalie Rowe:-


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.... and it is written: Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.

Another day, another broken Tory promise.  


https://youtu.be/CxS-Tow-Qik

Pretty much what we all expected

Personally, I've never been a fan of Tax Credits - I'm more a living wage kind of person.

Sadly this government seems determined we will have neither

The Tories dislike "benefits" on ideological grounds, but there are good reasons for examining any such system from time to time in order to establish fitness for purpose.  Times change, creating new stresses which need to be taken into consideration.

What do they do?

Tax Credits for working families are effectively a subsidy to Employers.

Housing Benefit is a subsidy to private landlords.

Railtrack, now Network Rail, was created at privatisation to "introduce some slack" so that Train Operators could make a profit.  Taxpayers meet the shareholder dividends without which privatisation of the Railways simply could not have happened - or continue.

Critics of "the living wage" say it shouldn't be imposed on small firms because they won't be able to afford it.  A comparison might be with small businesses that say they can't afford to pay tax.

Nobody has said or done anything about the employers who do not pay the £7.20, what I want to know is how those families will mange because they will between a rock & a hard place. I wonder what Davy boy will do when this happens as normal SFA.

A few months before the last election, a caller to a radio programme asked Harriet Harman: “Who should pay more tax, the working class or the middle class?”. Like anyone who believes in progressive taxation, she replied: “The middle class should pay more”. Immediately, Grant Shapps claimed that Labour was proposing a tax increase for the middle class, although Harriet had said nothing of the sort.

One of the Goebbelesque lies which will be repeated ad nauseum for years to come is that Jeremy Corbyn “sympathises with terrorists and thinks bin Laden’s death was a tragedy”. He actually said that it was a tragedy bin Laden hadn’t been arrested and put on trial. I don’t agree with him – I can imagine how many hostages would have been captured and murdered by al-Qaeda supporters during the process – but it is a reasonable point of view to suggest that ‘civilised’ people should use the law rather than behave as terrorists do.

This article shows how Cameron who, only a couple of weeks ago claimed to welcome Corbyn’s less confrontational style of politics, has tried to exploit the story:-

Jeremy Corbyn says David Cameron's conference speech attack shows Conservatives are 'rattled'

From an article by Lizzie Dearden:-

Cameron targeted Jeremy Corbyn while closing the Conservative Party conference with his keynote speech: “My friends, we cannot let that man inflict his security-threatening, terrorist-sympathising, Britain-hating ideology on the country we love”, he said, after criticising comments Mr Corbyn made about Osama bin Laden in 2011.

"The fact that David Cameron used his speech to make personal attacks on Jeremy Corbyn is a sure sign that he is rattled by the re-energisation of the Labour Party”, a Labour spokesperson said. “With cuts to tax credits and a continued failure on housing, his claim that the Conservatives are the party of working people is being exposed.” Mr Corbyn’s official campaign group dismissed the speech as “personalised, playground attacks”.

Cameron had highlighted an interview with Iranian television four years ago when the Islington North MP called the death of Osama bin Laden a tragedy. But supporters of Mr Corbyn said the remarks were deliberately taken out of context. Mr Corbyn complained that there had been “no attempt whatsoever that I can see to arrest (the al-Qaeda leader) and put him on trial, to go through that process. This was an assassination attempt, and is yet another tragedy, upon a tragedy, upon a tragedy. The World Trade Centre was a tragedy, the attack on Afghanistan was a tragedy, the war in Iraq was a tragedy.”

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-says-david-camerons-conference-speech-attack-shows-conservatives-are-rattled-a6684806.html

There's a process being played out here that seems to be less about politics than about styles of communication and philosophies.

For most of my life, I've been convinced by the notions of fairness, honesty, civilised debate, balance and respect for all others.  These are not the principles under which the current government operates - they seem to glory in telling lies, in the irresponsible use of power, in increasing inequality and promoting hatred and dehumanisation of groups in society - and it seems to be working for them. In private conversations I have been accused of 'talking bollocks' because of pointing out instances of unfairness and dishonesty by the government, or suggesting, quietly, that we all get along better if we look after all sections of society - there's definitely an appetite out there at present for the world-view being peddled by the Tories.

The lovely thing about Corbyn for me is that finally here is a prominent figure clearly articulating the opposing point of view and allowing the post Thatcher generation to have access to those ideas of fairness, equality, honesty etc that to me are axiomatic. I don't know where this may be heading - maybe the world does need its fascist moment and Corbyn will sink without trace - but at least the debate is now open and despite the efforts of the press there is now a popular interest in thinking about and debating the ethical dimension of politics - a debate where the Tories will always be on the back foot.

It seems to me, the more desperate they are to smear him in the media, the more people are going to wonder just why they can't debate policy with him rather than just call him names.

Wasn't it Margaret Thatcher who said, if your political opponents resort to personal abuse it's because they have nothing with which to challenge your ideas?

If the Tory media are so keen on omitting parts of speeches by Corbyn they should add the words Cameron left out during his keynote speech....

Here's what i think he really wanted to say.......

“My (Tory) friends, we (Tory's) cannot let that man inflict his security-threatening (Of the Wealthy) , terrorist-sympathising (Unlike our Rebel supporting), Britain-hating (Sell it off to China) ideology on the (Tory) country we love”

I could not watch Davy boys speech because I knew it would be full of BARE FACED LIES and from what I have seen on the news programes I was spot on, who in there right mind would change from voting Labour to vote Tory I know some Labour voters are not willing to give JC a chance, but surely they would not give there vote to Davy boy and his OINKS.

I still say wait until the SHYTE his the fan when the letters go out to people telling them there tax credits are being stopped then the people will see what the real Tories want to do to the low paid.

People should know that JC would not be so VILE & CRUEL to the people of the UK, as the Tories and there Hench men.

Here's the head of a governing body which is steeped in corruption and cronyism. And with him is Sepp Blatter.  


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Two of a kind Ivan, I wonder if either of them gave each other tips on how to cover up there CORRUPTION ???

A list of official rebukes for Tory lies

From a blog by Kitty S. Jones (Twitter ID: @suejone02063672)



https://kittysjones.wordpress.com/2014/11/25/a-list-of-official-rebukes-for-tory-lies/

There is one thing they aren't lying about - The Tories (with only a slender majority in the Commons) are running scared of Jeremy Corbyn becoming Prime Minister as unexpectedly as he became Party Leader.

Could the reason be the Tories are scared that JC will tell the general public the truth about what the Tories have being doing to the UK over the last 5 years, and we all know that will not be pleasant reading for any of the UK OW.

This article is nearly two years old, but it’s still a useful reminder of how the Tories try to cover up their lies and broken promises…..  

Tory archives deleted: the speeches they'd rather we forgot

The Tories have been caught removing a decade of speeches from the internet, but thanks to the British Library's archives, Channel 4 News has listed some of the statements they wanted us to forget.

Examples:-

"If we want to stop the state controlling us, we must confront this surveillance state." (Cameron, June 2009)

"We are the only party committed to protecting NHS spending. It's there in black and white behind me. I'll cut the deficit, not the NHS." (Cameron, January 2010)

“Absolutely crucial to our vision for the new Britain is data transparency. We are passionate about the genuinely transformative powers of free data…The era of closed shop government is over." (Francis Maude, 2010)

"We can't go on like this. I believe it’s time we shone the light of transparency on lobbying in our country and forced our politics to come clean about who is buying power and influence." (Cameron, February 2010)

For more details:-
http://www.channel4.com/news/conservatives-cache-archive-speeches-election-cameron

oftenwrong wrote:There is one thing they aren't lying about - The Tories (with only a slender majority in the Commons) are running scared of Jeremy Corbyn becoming Prime Minister as unexpectedly as he became Party Leader.
 

I agree OW just think if JC becomes the PM in 2020 (or sooner) when he gets his hands on the true facts & figures it will be mind blowing and beyond anything that we have thought.

Good post Ivan and very true, but the thick Tory gov't have not got a bloody clue if normal people do not have money to spend it will be there mates & donors that will suffer because it will be Tory businesses that will go to the wall (HELL SLAP IT INTO THEM) I am sorry that Gordon Brown & Alistair Darling saved all those bankers.    They should have just saved one and let the rest "GO TO HELL"

A monopoly Bank?

Not today, thank you. We already have a near-cartel situation anyway.

Anybody that believe him Ivan must have been DOO-LALLY when they went to the polling stations.    It makes me sad but I can see the SNP getting there way  = Independence in Scotland but we will be no different to Tory run England because you cannot get a fag paper between SNP & Tory gov't.

Yes, the Tories are deceitful – but I take my hat off to their political sorcery

From an article by Owen Jones:-

Cameron’s EU negotiation is a sham. He understands that a considerable source of anti-EU hostility is motivated by opposition to immigration. And so he conducts a charade, pledging to satisfy a lust to close British borders by compelling EU migrants to work in Britain for 4 years before they can receive in-work benefits. He didn’t need Sir Stephen Nickell of the OBR to say that the impact of such a move would be “not much”.

Illusions are what the Tories excel at. They back Labour’s spending when in opposition, then in government claim that it was financial extravagance that plunged the country into economic chaos. The crash may have originated in Britain’s financial hub, a sector whose lavish donations keep the Conservatives financially afloat, but Cameron and Osborne skilfully transformed a crisis of the market into a crisis caused by state spending. A failing of laissez-faire economics was spun into a historic opportunity to scale back the state. The colossal failure to close the deficit in a single parliament – as Osborne had solemnly promised – became a success. An alleged scandal involving Tory private donors became an opportunity to introduce a lobbying bill that left corporate titans alone, instead focusing on NGOs that might scrutinise the Tories’ record. And so on.

What the Tories understand is that politics is as much about sentiments and emotions as anything else.  
They excel at distorting perceptions rather than dealing in actual realities. To believe that politics is conducted solely at the level of reason is to lose.

For the whole article:-
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/10/tories-deceitful-political-sorcery-eu-cameron-magician-labour-must-learn

The best thing about it Ivan is a LIAR ALWAYS gets caught out in there Lies and do not be too surprised if 2016 is the year that happens, with Osborne borrowing more that what he said he would people are not that stupid. I would think when IDS brings in Universal credits in April 2016 that could be the KICK OFF point.

"Yes, we back Sure Start. It's a disgrace that Gordon Brown has been trying to frighten people about this.” (Cameron, 5 May 2010)

“Sure Start funding is protected and  centres do not need to close." (Cameron, PMQs, 2 March 2011)


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Just another Tory BARE FACED from Davy boy and his shower of OINKS, I wish people would wake up and realise what they voted for in May 2015, maybe when the Universal credits come in plus the rest of what the Tories are doing to the UK turning it into a little America then heaven help us all.