Should Cabinet exit controls be relaxed so that Theresa May can be kicked out?

First topic message reminder :

If the government really want people to inform them of known illegal immigrants, shouldn't they pay a bounty of say £10,000 per dozen grassed. Not only would it possibly lower the cost of public services, it would also create a boom in jobs. Just think of the growth possibilities for public sector workers to start their own business>

Ahhh Redflag....Bless!!! So niave, but I know youre young and have time to learn

blueturando wrote:Ahhh Redflag....Bless!!! So niave, but I know youre young and have time to learn

Blue it does not become you to be so PATRONIZING, and since I managed to survive the Maggots gov't I think I know how the bloody Tories work, you may not be naive but knowing that your a Tory tells me everything I need to know, and your posts tell me everything else.

But Thatchers government was the old Tories, this is New Conservatives now and very different

blueturando wrote:But Thatchers government was the old Tories, this is New Conservatives now and very different

There is not that much difference between the Thatcher gov't and Scam..er..ons blue, but one difference I have noticed "THERE ARE A BIGGER SHOWER OF INCOMPETENT BACKSTUDS and will go down in history as such, so I hope that as a Tory voter you will be very proud of that!!!

It would appear that for all her faults Teresa May has managed to get rid of Qatada, several Labour Home Secretaries failed miserably to fight hard enough to achieve this, each bowing down and showing their rears to Europe. Perhaps it's time to applaud her?

tlttf.  Your posts become more and more absurd and more dishonest. You pretend to support independents (yet voted for Boris Johnson), whilst taking every opportunity to knock Labour with your grubby little snippets from trash newspapers, or praise the Tories (even mimicking the cretinous George Osborne - ‘Welfare Party’). Who are you trying to convince of your so-called independence, when all you ever peddle is right-wing shyte?
 
Mrs May and the Tories deserve no credit whatsoever for getting rid of Abu Qatada; you’ve conveniently forgotten that earlier this year he agreed to leave voluntarily. You also choose to ignore that it was the Tories who gave him asylum here, back in 1994. I see that when asked whether Abu Qatada's wife and children would have the right to stay in the UK, Mrs May said they would have to decide what they want their future to be before the government gets involved.
 
It has been British government policy for decades not to deport people to countries which might execute them - and not to rely on evidence obtained by torture. That’s because Britain is a signatory to the European Convention on Human Rights. You display your ignorance yet again when you try to smear the EU because of that. The ECHR comes under the jurisdiction of the Council of Europe, a separate entity from the EU, but don’t let facts like that get in the way of another of your pathetic 'arguments' (for want of a better word).
 
May should have been sacked long ago. In July 2011 she personally authorised the relaxation of border controls. She was forced to admit to the Commons that she would never know how many people had been allowed into the UK without proper checks. Then she told a bare-faced lie to the Tory conference about an immigrant being allowed to stay here because he owned a cat. Last year, Abu Qatada’s deportation was delayed because she got the date wrong. Applaud her? You must be kidding.
 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23213740

Personally, I think the entire Cabinet should be sandpapered and varnished.

oftenwrong wrote:Personally, I think the entire Cabinet should be sandpapered and varnished.

Then put on display in the Tower of London for people to GAWK at that way they would USEFULL at last. 

Or perhaps we could use them as a useful shelf or garden ornament

boatlady wrote:Or perhaps we could use them as a useful shelf or garden ornament

 
I would not think they could be that useful boatlady, you and I know that they are a shower of DUMB CLUCKS.

Theresa May deports dying man in the dark of night and shames a nation
  
“Isa Muazu’s removal from the UK and potential death on a flight or upon arrival in Nigeria is not only a tragedy but an end to the UK’s reputation as a country with humane, civilised, just policies and government.” (Lord Roberts of Llandudno)
 
http://www.scriptonitedaily.com/2013/11/29/theresa-may-deports-dying-man-in-the-dark-of-night-and-shames-a-nation/

Ivan wrote:...you’ve conveniently forgotten that earlier this year he agreed to leave voluntarily...

Ivan, I think you are conveniently overlooking the fact that he has fought tooth and nail for ten years to avoid deportation and, I suspect only agreed to go voluntarily once it was clear that he was going anyway however he felt about it. That he was originally given asylum was because he represented himself as a persecuted refugee. That he then chose to abuse the asylum by preaching terrorism to british youths is also a matter of record. Frankly he is a poor choice to defend and equally frankly we are well rid of him. There are a whole host of others more worth your sympathy and support as other posts have shown.

Deporting a dying man on a chartered jet. How low can you get? I am sure they will limbo under any standard that I can imagine as a a base.

The Sunday Quiz: Name a Popular and/or Successful British Home Secretary since WW2.

Bellatori. You’ve got the wrong end of the stick; in no way was I defending the scumbag Abu Qatada. Perhaps you would be kind enough to read this page again. I objected to tlttf trying to give Theresa May credit for getting rid of him, especially as she was responsible for delaying the entire process for almost a year because she got the date wrong. The tortuous judicial process just happened to come to an end on her watch.

The Sunday Quiz: Name a Popular and/or Successful British Home Secretary since WW2.

 
Roy Jenkins (1965-67). In that short time, he presided over the abolition of capital punishment and theatre censorship, the decriminalisation of homosexuality, the relaxing of divorce law and the legalisation of abortion.

Quite so, but as seems to be customary with actual humans when one is found at Westminster - a prophet without honour in his own Country.

First Theresa May appointed the sister of the late Michael Havers to head an inquiry into historic child abuse. It’s been suggested that Havers was present at one of the drug-fuelled Tory conference parties where apparently children were abused. So there was a possible conflict of interest and his sister eventually stood down from the post.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tory-child-abuse-whistleblower-margaret-3849172

May should never have made that appointment and at the very least should have learned from her negligence. So then she appointed Fiona Woolf who, not only had no experience in the field of investigating child abuse, but knows Leon Brittan personally. When Brittan was home secretary he managed to lose a dossier on the subject, and he still has questions to answer on that and maybe more. If a judge had a person brought before them that they knew, he or she would have to declare an interest and pass the case to someone else.

When it turned out that the home office had, on six occasions, amended a letter which Woolf had submitted, in order to play down her connections with Brittan, her position became untenable and she has now resigned. Before she did, Cameron, that mediocre toff promoted way beyond his ability because of his royal connections, once again showed his appalling judgement by expressing his full confidence in Woolf.

Either May has shown breathtaking incompetence over this issue – as well as over the Border Agency fiasco, the lie about an asylum seeker and a cat, getting the date wrong over Abu Qatada’s deportation and failing to get passports processed promptly – or this is all part of a deliberate Tory ploy to delay the inquiry into child sex abuse for as long as possible. In either case she is totally unfit to be home secretary.

Theresa May is one of the few Tory ministers who is not a cardboard-cutout caricature of Colonel Blimp. In 2002 she described them as THE NASTY PARTY.

The Home Office was labelled in November 2011 by former Home Secretary John Reid as "not fit for purpose" and is notorious as the graveyard of Ministerial ambition.

Reid was alleged to have made that remark in May 2006, before the home office was split into two departments (security and justice) the following year. It was in November 2011 that Reid told us the “not fit for purpose” line was actually said by a senior civil servant:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15786213

Theresa May would need a sex change to become a Colonel Blimp and frequent the Pease Pottage Conservative Club, but she’d pass for a blue-rinsed harridan from Surrey and seems to model herself on Thatcher. She coined the phrase ‘the nasty party’, but her actions in office have done more to reinforce rather than modify that description of the Tories.

As to May's incompetence, I should have added that the home office has lost 50,000 illegal migrants in the past two years, backlogs for new asylum cases have increased by 70%, and one in six foreign criminals living here have absconded.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/fiona-woolf-resigns-theresa-david-4545161

I have heard people describe Theresa May as one of the brighter lights of the current administration - can't say I've ever noticed it myself.

She seems to have a talent for public ineptitude that should in itself guarantee her dismissal - and, I would have thought fatally for a Home Secretary, she seems to have completely lost the confidence of the police, who I believe are currently considering industrial action of some sort

They cannot take industrial action can they boatlady? is it the their own law it is against? i'm sure Ivan is more knowledgeable on this matter than I am.

stu is quite right. The police were banned in 1919 from going on strike and that still applies under the most recent relevant piece of legislation, the Police Act of 1996.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21652384

I was almost there Ivan thought it was their own law so to speak.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/chris-hobbs/theresa-may-police_b_6076520.html

This is the article I remember - apologies - no reference to industrial action - just a load of VERY unhappy police officers - something I would imagine no Home Secretary really wants - they can make her look VERY bad, I would imagine

I imagine if they could have then a few might have though boatlady, but not that many I don't think.

The Tory Party must be congratulated upon their efforts to avoid being re-elected.

If their campaign effort was anything like here OW, WHERE Labour actually knocked on the door and gave you their leaflet having a chat at the same time, tory leaflet came through pushed through by mum going round with 5 and 7 year old daughters and one of daughters pushed mine through.

I just hope Stuart that Scottish Labour party have a rabbit to pull out of the hat because if Labour lose seats here in Scotland they will not get a majority Labour gov't and the UK could end up with another 5 years of "CALL ME DAVE".

The Tory Party must be congratulated upon their efforts to avoid being re-elected.

It begins to look almost deliberate - leading to the possibility that they planned it this way - one term is enough to dismantle nearly all our national institutions - maybe they figure it won't be possible for their successors to rebuild

OR - UKIP is actually the new Tory Party, and all the Tory resources are quietly being transferred into UKIP with a view to giving us a REALLY right wing government in the near future

You know boatlady you just could be right there (no pun intended)
As I hear more and more people coming out with racist comments these days, than I ever did 5years ago.

The world in general is getting nastier, it seems to me - we need to be very actively presenting the alternative view

Challenge racism and other forms of prejudice wherever you meet them

boatlady wrote:The world in general is getting nastier, it seems to me - we need to be very actively presenting the alternative view

Challenge racism and other forms of prejudice wherever you meet them

I agree entirely. But that's easier said than done.

I have a couple of friends who are fundamentally nice people, and very hospitable. But, thanks to the relentless drip drip of poison from the right wing media, are vulnerable to prejudice, albeit not overtly. It manifests as a kind of casual prejudice that is no less awful but difficult to challenge, i find, without being overbearing. I say this because i suspect this is the result of a midnset that feels beseiged: people read about immigrants perceived to be swamping their communities etc. They feel under siege and their way of life (for what that way of life is worth) is being consumed. So my concern is how to challenge these attitudes, when they appear, in a way that doesn't polarise or seem adversarial or overbearing. "That's just a load of lefty nonsense" etc.

The underlying besieged - ie under the cosh of 'political correctness' - mentality is the real problem. Forcing a more responsible press would be a real start.

boatlady wrote:The world in general is getting nastier, it seems to me - we need to be very actively presenting the alternative view

Challenge racism and other forms of prejudice wherever you meet them

All this nastiness is thanks to the Tory gov't and Ukip boatlady, they have made the unemployed sick and disable people of the UK the scapegoats just to take the limelight off themselves and all the underhand things they are doing. The second reason for me wanting a Labour gov't is sso all there underhand dealing will come out.

It is also because of cheap and nasty press getting more right wing and nastier is it not?

It is largely the fault of the press.

WHich isn't to absolve the tories and the right wing in general of any responsibility because they are all part of the problem. But the press is more pervasive and more influential.

It seems like they are in this nasty plot together G.W. to ensure that the Tories get voted back in, and the way it's going they will.

Norman Baker resigns as a minister - because of Theresa May:-

"I regret that in the Home Office, the goodwill to work collegiately to take forward rational evidence-based policy has been in somewhat short supply."


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B1jV4kxIgAE8TGn.jpg

stuart torr wrote:It seems like they are in this nasty plot together G.W. to ensure that the Tories get voted back in, and the way it's going they will.

I can see your point but just hope you have got this one wrong, instead of kicking out Teresa May it seems Baker L/D MP has quit the cabinet due to the bloody mindless Tory MP  May

Between now and the date of the General Election, it's likely that more than just a few Lib-Dem components of the coalition will be considering their position.

Doubt if any will stay elected if they stayed lib/dem, so they will probably change parties OW.

So my concern is how to challenge these attitudes, when they appear, in a way that doesn't polarise or seem adversarial or overbearing. "That's just a load of lefty nonsense" etc.


I'm sort of feeling England needs it's fascist moment (not sure why) - all I think we can do is just be relentlessly citing evidence and helping people reality check their media inspired prejudices - anything more aggressive and - you're right - one just gets accused of being a 'loony lefty'  - without shifting anyone's opinion.

We're quite lucky still in England - if we keep on being kind and thoughtful about each other we can up to now prevent too much harm coming to the victims of the government's nasty measures - we can look out for our neighbours, befriend those who are getting the bad press, invite people round for dinner when we've got a bit extra, even protest peacefully on occasion - all ways of challenging prejudice.
I'm a great believer - every time you treat a stranger with care and respect, you create a bit more tolerance and understanding in the world.

Do you respect that of truth in everyone though it may be expressed in unfamiliar ways or be difficult to discern? Each of us has a particular experience of truth and each must find the way to be true to it. When words are strange or disturbing to you, try to sense where they come from and what has nourished the lives of others. Listen patiently and seek the truth which other people's opinions may contain for you. Avoid hurtful criticism and provocative language. Do not allow the strength of your convictions to betray you into making statements or allegations that are unfair or untrue. Think it possible that you may be mistaken.  
Loosely transcribed from Advices and Queries, a core text for British Quakers