What future will the Lib Dems have by 2015?

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The Lib-Dems will not let Nick Clegg lead them into the next general election because Clegg will definitely be a liability.

The Lib-Dems won't have their leadership challenge too near the general election because this will be seen as a vote grabber.

The Lib-Dems must have their leadership challenge ages before the next general election to be seen as a genuine change of leadership.

So, when do you think their leadership challenge will be ?

Ivan wrote:Cornish actress Susan Penhaligon quits Lib Dems over reforms

http://www.thisiscornwall.co.uk/Cornish-actress-Susan-Penhaligon-quits-Lib-Dems/story-18628243-detail/story.html#axzz2PjGRDc1l

Glad to see that Lib-Dems members and voters have got consciences and are willing to be guided by them which cannot be said for Lib-Dem MPs in gov't, as I have said before they are nothing but a bunch of Prostitutes selling their souls to the Tories for crumbs of power.

I'm all for MPs taking a close interest in the well-being of their own local constituents, but when does that descend to Parish-pump politics?
The Lib-Dems in The Prime Minister's own Witney constituency have issued a campaign leaflet commenting upon the extraordinarily perfect state of West Oxfordshire roads surrounding the President's, sorry PM's, private residence (and the nearby seat of Lord Chadlington, formerly Selwyn Gummer) in stark contrast to West Oxford's pot-hole-strewn carriageways generally.

What could be the reason?

To me OW this smacks of a "Done Deal" between the tories and Lib-Dems they are hoping for another L/D Tory coalition in 2015, when in reality the Tories would sell the L/Ds down the river to get a majority in the H.O.C. So if the L/Ds are wise they will grow a pair of eyes in their backs because the Tories would stab them in the back to get what they want, sneaky backstuds.

Today, Parliament was recalled, to say appropriate things about The Departed, and I almost felt sorry for Nick Clegg, trapped in a coalition and forced to sit alongside his Tory companion.

There is little room in the Lib-Dem psyche for platitudes about the wicked things set in train by Thatcher.

oftenwrong wrote:Today, Parliament was recalled, to say appropriate things about The Departed, and I almost felt sorry for Nick Clegg, trapped in a coalition and forced to sit alongside his Tory companion.

There is little room in the Lib-Dem psyche for platitudes about the wicked things set in train by Thatcher.

Oftenwrong do not feel sorry for Cleggy he deserves everything he gets along with the rest of the Lib-Dems which will only come in May 2015, I suspect they will be punished very harshly for jumping into bed with the Tories and waving every nasty bill through the H.O.C, just for crumbs of power that the Tories where prepared to give them, they behaved in such away that I now call them the PROSTITUTE Party they forgot their Manifesto promises and their own beliefs of their party.

At the moment I am reading a book called "5 Days in May" by Andrew Adonis and my jaw has never hit the deck so many times, I like others watched this in May 2010 live and had drawn my own conclusion at the time, then to read this book and find that my conclusions at the time where spot on.

Clegg had used the Labour party as a lever to get more out of Cameron and the Lib-Dems had NO intensions of forming a coalition with Labour from the begining, in truth the day after the general election Clegg approached Cameron in regards to them going into coalition together. Even to go as so far as to tell the Labour party they could not work with Gordon Brown and he would have to go before there was any serious negotiation between Lib-Dems & Labour knowing all the time they had no intensions of, perhaps Clegg did not want to face GB from the across the dispatch box or that GB would show him up for what he really is. There is others in this plot Paddy Pants Down David Laws Danny Alexander Laws who did not last long in the coalition due to paying rent to his partner out of the tax payers pocket which came to around £60,000.

Clegg's mother was dutch and his politics were continental, his wife is not just Spanish but the daughter of a Spanish Conservative parliamentarian, also Laws L/D and Osborne had a mutual admiration society going on, for reasons of the laws of this land I can not say too much I do not want to get Ivan or this forum into trouble, but would recommend you to get out and buy it this goes against the grain but you may get it cheaper on line but it is one read I would advise you all to read.

As for the title of this thread in my opinion "ROASTING in HELL" by 2015 I used to think it was disgraceful the way the back bench Tories spoke to the Lib-Dems in the H.O.C now my thoughts are "HELL SLAP IT INTO THEM" they deserve eveything the Tories do and say to them they are the typical wolf in sheep's clothing.

Saw some reviews for that book and I may have to read the whole thing - seems there was lots of behind-the scenes stuff that stitched up poor Gordon and the rest of the party.

Still, I guess that's politics, unless we can find a better way.

boatlady wrote:Saw some reviews for that book and I may have to read the whole thing - seems there was lots of behind-the scenes stuff that stitched up poor Gordon and the rest of the party.

Still, I guess that's politics, unless we can find a better way.

If you can boatlady get a copy in my post its only half of it I used to think that Clegg was nothing more than a Patsy for the Tories I even though of them as the Prostitute party selling their principles for crumbs of power how wrong and naive I was. It lets you see the Lib-Dems in their true colours, it tells how the leaders of the Lib-Dems are more Tory than some the book refers to Ken Clarke are in line with Clegg & Laws who wrote the Orange book and his own version of May 2010 called 22 days in May but does not print in the book the policy papers given to the Labour party nor did they fight the 2010 election with what was written in those papers.

The Coalition has been a three-year game of bluff, which the Tory element have found easy because they're accustomed to rule by deception. After eighty-years in Parliament as spectators, it's perfectly understandable that the Lib-Dems would grasp at any straw of modernising Britain's electoral system that might level the playing-field. When agreeing a "free vote" the unpractised Libs imagined that meant what it sounded like - a personal choice.
As everybody now knows, the other principal parliamentary parties voted in favour of the status quo along Party lines. Lesson Number One.

Lesson number two for any third-party thinking of an alliance with one of the Main parties at the next General Election is ... Lesson One.

Maybe we'll have another "National Government" like the one which filled the vacuum of the 1930s.

What larks that would be!

boatlady wrote:Saw some reviews for that book and I may have to read the whole thing - seems there was lots of behind-the scenes stuff that stitched up poor Gordon and the rest of the party.

Still, I guess that's politics, unless we can find a better way.

Boatlady there was two people in the Labour party that were not taken in even from the first day that was Peter Mandelson and Andy Burnham, they did not believe a word the Lib-Dems said about going into coalition with Labour and they let the people concerned know and the Lib-Dems noticed it too in the body langauge and pointed it out to the Labour negotiation team.

The first rat to leave the sinking ship. Liberal Democrat MP Sarah Teather (who had a majority of just 1,345 in 2010) has decided not to stand at the 2015 general election:-
 
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/sep/07/sarah-teather?

I knew there had to be a Lib-Dem with a conscience SOMEWHERE in the Coalition.

It took her long enough to find her conscience, I did not think she would be the first one I thought Andrew George or John Pugh, but maybe the rest will follow her, who knows OW.

Will she continue in the job of MP as an Independant MP or will she still back her leader in the Tory nasty bills  bobby? I think even some of the Tories have discovered they will not be voted back into there seats at the 2015 general election, I have seen more venom coming thick and fast from the Tories targetted at the Labour party plus a slight distain for the Lib-Dems this could be the break away the Tory back benches have always wanted and perhaps there wishes will be granted which they did not realize could cause an early general election HOORAY!

The second thing all political party Managers learn after, "First get yourself elected", is damage-limitation. This first defection of a coalition-member will be presented by all three parties as an advance. The critical change will come from resignations two and three.

Honest traditional Liberals must find the atmosphere inside the House of Commons difficult to breathe. So why are they still there? For the same reason that a shipwrecked sailor will hang onto a piece of driftwood - it's all they have to sustain them.

Do you think any more Lib-Dems will give Cleggy the bums rush OW or go further than Sarah Teather and hand in their membership of the Lib-Dems?

Since you ask, Redflag, I don't expect an avalanche of Lib-Dem resignations, for the simple reason that, for them, all the alternatives to Coalition mean unemployment.

Thanks OW but do think the reason partly for Teathers putting out that statement was a few of her constituents had told her in no uncertain terms do not come looking for my vote at the 2015 general election or words to that effect

You may well be right, Redflag. The First World War popular song springs to mind: "Oh we don't want to lose you, but we think you ought to go!"

I think the best songs come from WW1, OW.

The Oldies are the Goodies, you're right there. Speaking of Oldies, the high point of Liberal ascendancy came 80 years ago when David Lloyd George was PM.

Whatever happened to him?

Didn't he join a post-WW1 coalition with the Tories, which ended in 1922 with the Liberals being emasculated for almost ninety years?

Lloyd George knew my father ; father knew Lloyd George.

But we don't like to talk about it...

Ivan wrote:Didn't he join a post-WW1 coalition with the Tories, which ended in 1922 with the Liberals being emasculated for almost ninety years?

So what happened in 2010 is not the first time the Lib-Dems have sold body & soul to the Tories, I hope this time instead of being emasculated they are ANNIHILATED Ivan.

It looks like the Lib-Dems have picked up the banner for Tory Lite, after listening to the conference it looks like if the UK is silly enough to vote them back into power in May 2015 all we will get is more of the same, Tory cuts which will more than likely mean OAP pensions and more Welfare cuts and the end of OUR NHS as we know it.
 
I believe it was Laws that started the orange book politics, now we all know WHY the Lib-Dems agreed to all the nasty cuts the Tories have inflicted on the people of the UK its because they have become Tory Lite and believe that is why Cleggy wanted to go into coalition with the Tories there beliefs where more intune with the Tories, there conference was them trying to BRIBE the UK to vote for them as there activists and councillors have been getting it in the neck on the majority of doorsteps from the people that are suffering these cuts.
 
I also think what was said at there conference STINKS of A FIX between the Lib-Dems and Tories because they know the only people that will vote for them in 2015 are those stupid enough to believe them again just like the Uni students did in 2010, but hope people do not allow them to pull the wool over there eyes this time and take time tothink before they go to vote in May 2015.

Let's hope they are totally wiped out. Any use they had to anyone ended in 1910, and it is a long time ago.

Penderyn wrote:Let's hope they are totally wiped out....

Amen to that, Penderyn.  None of the recent Tory attacks on the Poor/disadvantaged/sick would have been possible without the connivance of the Lib-Dems, so I don't think it's unreasonable to say that it is ALL their fault.  

Clegg knows they have to move to the Right because they are now firmly embedded as such in the public's perception.

IMHO, the worst outcome of a 2015 Election would be a Labour "almost-victory" that required a Lib-Lab Pact coalition in order to form a Government.  (Pass the sick-bag.)

oftenwrong wrote:

Penderyn wrote:Let's hope they are totally wiped out....

Amen to that, Penderyn.  None of the recent Tory attacks on the Poor/disadvantaged/sick would have been possible without the connivance of the Lib-Dems, so I don't think it's unreasonable to say that it is ALL their fault.  

Clegg knows they have to move to the Right because they are now firmly embedded as such in the public's perception.

IMHO, the worst outcome of a 2015 Election would be a Labour "almost-victory" that required a Lib-Lab Pact coalition in order to form a Government.  (Pass the sick-bag.)

I think what people have been saying about the Yellow Tories is spot on "There more Tory than the Tories", if this weeks conference is anything to go by the Lib-Dem activists are nothing more than lily livered no hopers, because the only thing there worried about is getting there councillor or MP into office and FCUK the voters as long as they get power.

I just hope OW that Labour get a majority and the Lib-Dems get ANNIHILATED at the 2015 general election, but betterthan that and would give up a big win on the lottery to see Cleggy & Cameron completely lose there seats not forgetting the Ginger Rodent in Inverness (his seat) if God is listening to my prayers he could be a tad angry with me. 

Redflag wrote:

oftenwrong wrote:

Penderyn wrote:Let's hope they are totally wiped out....

Amen to that, Penderyn.  None of the recent Tory attacks on the Poor/disadvantaged/sick would have been possible without the connivance of the Lib-Dems, so I don't think it's unreasonable to say that it is ALL their fault.  

Clegg knows they have to move to the Right because they are now firmly embedded as such in the public's perception.

IMHO, the worst outcome of a 2015 Election would be a Labour "almost-victory" that required a Lib-Lab Pact coalition in order to form a Government.  (Pass the sick-bag.)

I think what people have been saying about the Yellow Tories is spot on "There more Tory than the Tories", if this weeks conference is anything to go by the Lib-Dem activists are nothing more than lily livered no hopers, because the only thing there worried about is getting there councillor or MP into office and FCUK the voters as long as they get power.

I just hope OW that Labour get a majority and the Lib-Dems get ANNIHILATED at the 2015 general election, but betterthan that and would give up a big win on the lottery to see Cleggy & Cameron completely lose there seats not forgetting the Ginger Rodent in Inverness (his seat) if God is listening to my prayers he could be a tad angry with me. 

The theory that God is a tory is just the usual bullshit put around by the Noise Machine. He is in fact Old Labour, and Jesus is w-a-y to the left of that!

I agree Penderyn, God was the Old Labour party, and I hope he returns to the UK soon.

Ivanhoe wrote:The Lib-Dems will not let Nick Clegg lead them into the next general election because Clegg will definitely be a liability.

The Lib-Dems won't have their leadership challenge too near the general election because this will be seen as a vote grabber.

The Lib-Dems must have their leadership challenge ages before the next general election to be seen as a genuine change of leadership.

So, when do you think their leadership challenge will be ?

 
After the election. I don't think they are so stupid as to plunge themselves into a leadership battle this close to an election. Given how few candidates they have for such a position (noone had heard of Clegg before) it would be, for them, suicide.
 
Not that I'm complaining.
 
I suspect Clegg will survive the Night of the Long Knives in 2015 because too many people have an interest in keeping him where he is. More than likely the result of the next election will be another hung parliament which I fear will lead to either a minority government - though Miliband may argue that he can only countenane a coalition with the libs if Clegg goes. He knows that won't be popular though, putting them back into power. Either that or another torylib coalition with more of the same.
 
I'm hoping the libs will be annihilated.

Have you ever thought that Cleggy will not win his seat in Hallam Sheffeild GW,because that is where he has said he is standing, and if he does not win a seat there is F-All he can do except perhaps try the EU for a job.  Like yourself I think the Prostitute party will be ANNIHILATED at the G.E. in May 2015.

I think that Clegg's European pals will have been keeping a seat warm for him in Brussels as a safety-net, but he's probably an irrelevance to Ed Miliband, whose principal danger lies in voter apathy.

I really hope that seat has gone stone cold now OW, as I want him to pay for all the NASTINESS he has helped the VILE Tories heap on the good people of the UK its no less than what he and his Prostitute party deserve from the people of the UK.:yeahthat:

Redflag wrote:Have you ever thought that Cleggy will not win his seat in Hallam Sheffeild GW,because that is where he has said he is standing, and if he does not win a seat there is F-All he can do except perhaps try the EU for a job.  Like yourself I think the Prostitute party will be ANNIHILATED at the G.E. in May 2015.

I have thought about it and would love for him to be booted out, but I think he's set. I suspect he's angling for a seat in the Lords, snout firmly at the trough. The Tories seem hell bent on stuffing the Lords full of their supporters. It's possible they may snub him, after all Deputy PM is a useless position. Either that or he will go full time on LBC alongside dog whistle balloon animal Nick Ferrarri.

I agree GW, after the amount of people that have been stuffed into the House of Lords by Cameron and Cleggy I think it's ready for a good old fashoined clean out, I think that Ed Miliband will do it if he gets a majority in the May 2015 general election, it would help Ed save money as there are over 800 Lords in the House so if he cuts that by 500-600 that would save a fortune in their daily £300.00 plus expenses which could be used for OUR NHS or Schools, which would be a much better use of tax payers money. So let Cleggy hope for a seat in the Lords, Cameron will be unable to help him there because he will not be PM after May 2015.

Redflag wrote:-
So let Cleggy hope for a seat in the Lords, Cameron will be unable to help him there because he will not be PM after May 2015.

 
I have to disagree with you on two points.
 
Firstly, Sheffield Hallam is a very safe Lib Dem seat. In 2010, the result was:-
Clegg     27,324
Tory      12,040
Labour     8,228
UKIP        1,195
Green         919
 
As your own experience in Eastleigh showed, even though the Lib Dem vote went down, the Tory vote also fell, and it would be a tall order to expect Labour to win Sheffield Hallam on those figures. Sadly, I think Clegg will survive.
 
Secondly, Cameron, either through his resignation Honours List or as Leader of the Opposition in 2015 (before the Tories kick him out), could nominate Clegg or anyone else for a peerage. You may recall how Hague used his position to give one peerage to Norman Lamont, one of the most disastrous Chancellors in our history, and another to the Tory donor Lord Ashcroft, who wasn’t even resident in this country.

Redflag wrote:I agree GW, after the amount of people that have been stuffed into the House of Lords by Cameron and Cleggy I think it's ready for a good old fashoined clean out, I think that Ed Miliband will do it if he gets a majority in the May 2015 general election, it would help Ed save money as there are over 800 Lords in the House so if he cuts that by 500-600 that would save a fortune in their daily £300.00 plus expenses which could be used for OUR NHS or Schools, which would be a much better use of tax payers money. So let Cleggy hope for a seat in the Lords, Cameron will be unable to help him there because he will not be PM after May 2015.

I can't see Miliband doing that. I don't think it's in his interests. The whole system needs fundamental change which is beyond either party at present. For the moment we need to staunch the bleeding and kick these evil swine in power right now out. This has to be a priority.

Ivan wrote: Sheffield Hallam is a very safe Lib Dem seat........As your own experience in Eastleigh showed, even though the Lib Dem vote went down, the Tory vote also fell, and it would be a tall order to expect Labour to win Sheffield Hallam on those figures. Sadly, I think Clegg will survive.

 
Sorry Ivan I think I mentioned on another thread that while  I was in Manchester on Sunday the N.U.S from Hallam Sheffield was at the protest and since you know what the protest was about and that Cleggy has waved EVERY nasty Tory Bill through the H.O.C, I can not see the good people of Sheffield vote for the Prostitute party after they have done nothing more than ANNIHILATION of them will satisfy me.:yeahthat: